| Time | Speaker | Text |
|---|---|---|
| 00:00:06.34 | Herb Weiner | Okay, good evening and welcome to the meeting of the November 1st, oh wow, November 1 already, 2011. At this time here we will Take a roll call. |
| 00:00:25.26 | Unknown | Councilmember Pfeiffer? Here. Councilmember Ford? Here. Councilmember Leon? Here. Vice Mayor Kelly? Here. Mayor Weiner? |
| 00:00:33.81 | Herb Weiner | Present. At this time here, we'll go into closed session on an item of Zacks versus Sausalito. Is there any public comment on this closed session item? Okay, with that, Well, we turn. |
| 00:00:59.28 | Herb Weiner | Debbie, are we ready? Okay, let's get ready to rumble. |
| 00:01:10.43 | Herb Weiner | Okay, good evening and welcome to the November 1st, 2011 Council Meeting. Debbie, would you take a roll call, please? |
| 00:01:22.31 | Unknown | Council member Seifert? Here. Council member Ford? Here. Council member Leon? |
| 00:01:27.22 | Herb Weiner | here. |
| 00:01:27.92 | Unknown | Vice Mayor Kelly. Mayor Weiner. |
| 00:01:30.41 | Herb Weiner | present. We're going to have a Pledge of Allegiance, and Vasco, you want to lead us in the pledge, please? |
| 00:01:42.17 | Herb Weiner | I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. |
| 00:01:44.74 | Unknown | you |
| 00:01:46.51 | Herb Weiner | and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you, Vesco. Okay. We had a discussion on a closed item, and that was with Zacks versus City of Sausalito. At this time here, is there any public comment on that closed session item? Okay, therefore, I'll move for the next item, which will be the approval of the agenda. Do you have an approval? |
| 00:02:22.22 | Carolyn Ford | Mr. Mayor? |
| 00:02:22.24 | Herb Weiner | Mr. Mayor. Yeah. Yes. |
| 00:02:24.29 | Carolyn Ford | Just one comment here. I would ask tonight that we follow the Rosenberg Protocol. I would ask that you as the mayor require all city council members be recognized before speaking, that there be no interruptions of other city council members on or side conversations and under no circumstances should the public be interrupted as Mr. Ford was when he was publicly speaking. And certainly, misrepresentations are completely unacceptable. So I would ask you to please follow our Rosenberg's rules of order. Thank you. |
| 00:03:10.58 | Jonathan Leone | to us. |
| 00:03:10.85 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:03:10.87 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. Mr. Mayor, do you want to make his comment? Yeah. |
| 00:03:12.09 | Mary Wagner | Yes. Yeah. Thank you. |
| 00:03:14.16 | Jonathan Leone | I would echo Councilmember Ford's comments specifically with respect to Mr. Ford when he mentioned the exclusive negotiated agreement regarding the Lincoln Butte property. Some members of this council denied its existence. In fact, it does exist in draft form and it was wrong to interrupt Mr. Ford and it was wrong to deny its existence. And I think it's imperative that we stick to Rosenberg's rules of order. |
| 00:03:38.88 | Jonathan Leone | Yeah, point of order. There is no point on the agenda for council member statements in the beginning of a council meeting, so you've just violated what you just asked us to implement. |
| 00:03:40.32 | Unknown | Yeah. |
| 00:03:40.33 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 00:03:40.37 | Unknown | Thank you. |
| 00:03:40.47 | Mary Wagner | I'm not. |
| 00:03:40.97 | Unknown | agenda |
| 00:03:48.20 | Carolyn Ford | Point of order, Mr. Mayor, if I may. The question was whether the agenda was to be approved. |
| 00:03:54.71 | Jonathan Leone | Your comments were not on the agenda. |
| 00:03:56.23 | Carolyn Ford | Excuse me, point of order. One person at a time speaks. And my comment was regarding the agenda and how we follow our agenda and how we institute our protocol. So I do believe it's appropriate. Thank you very much. |
| 00:04:13.46 | Herb Weiner | Sure. |
| 00:04:17.63 | Herb Weiner | Small town, big ideas. Okay. |
| 00:04:21.56 | Linda Pfeifer | That's right. Mr. Mayor, I think there was a, I believe I heard a motion on the floor to approve the agenda. Yes, I seconded it. |
| 00:04:26.12 | Herb Weiner | Yes, sir. Thank you. Okay, all in favor? Ayes. Opposed? Okay. |
| 00:04:29.90 | Linda Pfeifer | Bye. |
| 00:04:33.85 | Herb Weiner | This time here we have a special presentation and that will be by Chief Jennifer Tahara. on the Sausalito Marine Patrol. |
| 00:05:18.87 | Unknown | Good evening, Mayor, Vice Mayor, and Council Members. Thank you for taking the time this evening to allow me to share with you some information about the Sausalito Police Department Marine Patrol Program. The Marine Patrol program was created in 2007, and it was created in partnership with the Richardson Bay Authority. And this is the boat that we acquired back in 2007. We share the maintenance and the maintenance of the ship. dock fee costs on this boat. When I came here in February. I started to look around to see, you know, educate myself about what we were doing and where our priorities should be. And when I looked at the waterfront, I saw that we were somewhat deficient in providing attention to that area, the waterfront on the water, the businesses, the residents, the park users. We have two and a half miles of waterfront that really had no designation as a beat within our organization. So the officers took me down and showed me this boat and I said, well, where are the police markings on it? And there aren't any. And I said, well, so how do people know that it's the police out there keeping everything safe? Thank you. Maybe they'll see our uniform. I don't know. So it didn't quite meet the standards that I would expect from a police marine patrol program. And so we started looking at options and ways to increase activity in the marine patrol program, as well as to enhance visibility and the number of times that were on the water. So we had limited use of this boat because it's shared with RBRA. We didn't have a set schedule for patrolling the bay. It was very hit and miss. And we didn't have very good records of what we were doing, the hours that we might have been spending and the contacts we were making. And there really wasn't any focus to the program other than getting the boat out on the water when we could. Our Marine Patrol program is staffed by a sergeant and six officers. And, of course, Sergeant Frost, who you're very familiar with, is leading the charge with this program and doing an outstanding job. So I want to give him a lot of credit tonight for most of this work. So when we look at what area of concern we have, this is what we're looking at. And you see beat one and beat two. These are the designated beats that were set when I arrived here. And then we didn't have any designation for that blue or purplish area along the waterfronts. So this is what we were tasked with. What do we do with that piece? How do we include that in our focus, in our responsibility to serve and protect? So the Marine Patrol program, they enforce local and state laws. They assist in many numerous emergency situations. Their focus is waterfront security, And most of all, creating a safe boating environment, an environment for everybody to enjoy, recreationally, residents, business owners, visitors. We have seven active marinas along that waterfront with anywhere, depending on who you ask, 1,700 to 2,500 birds. but it's a very large number nonetheless. So as we looked at activity on the water and our contacts and the drain on our resources, quality of life issues, this is what we found. And the top left slide shows you that there are of 27 people We just randomly selected these last week because I couldn't fit a whole lot on the slides, so I had to narrow down the group. But this is how many repeat contacts of those 27 people who actually, they live on the water. They're commonly called anchor outs. So of those 27 people, these are the repeat contacts. So in other words, these people are in the revolving door of running into us for some negative activity, whether it's a crime or it's a call for service for someone else, an emergency situation, rescuing one of their skiffs because it got away, taking their boat out of the water, drunk in public, it just runs the gamut. |
| 00:10:20.59 | Unknown | This is this year. So the top one is January through August, I believe. The bottom right one is April through August because that's when we really started gathering statistics and understanding what we're doing and what we're facing. |
| 00:10:35.80 | Herb Weiner | Excuse me. We can ask questions after her presentation, please. |
| 00:10:36.22 | Unknown | Thank you. |
| 00:10:42.07 | Unknown | Thank you. |
| 00:10:44.03 | Jonathan Leone | You're not observing Rosenberg's rules in the audience. We're going to have a quiz later about them. |
| 00:10:44.15 | Unknown | And these? |
| 00:10:47.09 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 00:10:47.19 | Mary Wagner | Quiz. |
| 00:10:51.20 | Unknown | So this is just some of the crimes that we encounter when we are enforcing the law along the waterfront. So these are not all on the waterfront. These are users of Dunphy Park. These are transients, boaters, anchor outs, These are all from the waterfront, not focused on any particular group. So when we look further then, we see that we have, oh, I forgot to say, we do baby doll rescue, and we also do plane rescue, and we also respond to tsunamis. So we do have other concerns, and as many of you know, you have either seen, or as I find when I talk about this, people have not seen, but they've heard about the anchor outboats. And so here are some images. These were taken last week. I have some from last winter in here, too. But there are numerous vessels out there that are permanently anchored and cause some concern to other boaters because a lot of these They move away from their anchors. A lot of them have hazardous conditions on board. Here's some more examples. So the environmental issues are paints, gasoline, human waste, and general garbage dumping from some of these boats. These pictures I took last week, and it's two separate boats, and as you can see, we have numerous violations on these boats that pose a threat to the life of the people living on the boat as it does to the people of the people living on the boat as it does to the people using the boats around them and the waterways. |
| 00:12:42.38 | Unknown | So what have we done? So we don't have a lot of money in the budget to do great things, but that's never stopped us before. So we worked with the Coast Guard and asked them to provide more training to our officers, and they did. We worked with the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, and they actually offered to allow us to use their 26-foot safe boat. Not only did they allow us to use it, but as you can see, They allowed us to put Sausalito Police Marine One on it. Marine One Shield, and it's equipped with lights. They've trained our six officers and our sergeant in the use of this boat. And that's at zero cost to the city of Sausalito. So it really is a great example of a federal agency partnering with a local agency to make things work so that we get the job done. We've established a designated BEAT-3 as that waterfront area. We have a regular patrol schedule through creative scheduling, as well as using available funds from the Tideland funds. We are in the process of creating a volunteer Marine Reserve Officer program because we cannot have one officer go out and use that boat. It requires two officers for safety reasons. Um, We will at some time be seeking funding for additional staffing because I anticipate it's going to be very difficult to maintain this level of engagement in the waterfront. But we continue to develop partnerships. We're looking at developing a police foundation nonprofit organization where people can donate money to police activities and equipment. We'll continue to do training. We have created a regional task force. There are, I think, nine agencies involved in it. They meet once a month so that we can all share information. And this is not just a law enforcement task force. As you've read in the newspaper, we're partnering with service providers. And today we actually had eight, I think it was eight people from Marin County Health and Human Services, and I think there were four nursing interns. They went out on the water in our boat. They contacted 16. Anchor out, I think 14 of them opted to take the flu shot. And I'm so happy to report that there's one guy out there, he's almost an invalid. I won't say his name for his privacy, but we've been really concerned about him. And today we made great progress with these homeless advocates to get him into care. I don't think he has much time left in this world. So to give him an opportunity to have dignity at the end of his life is an incredible that our officers are doing and this partnership, so it's really beneficial to a lot of people. These are the hours that we have, as you see, January, February, March, not a lot, but we increased them. Again, no extra cost to the city, increased our presence on the water. Thank you. Um... you And there's our beat three. So that concludes the presentation. It's just sort of a snapshot of what we're doing and what we're trying to do. And I'll take any questions if you have them. |
| 00:16:13.11 | Herb Weiner | you |
| 00:16:13.16 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:16:13.45 | Herb Weiner | Do we have any questions up here? All right. At this time here, anybody from the audience would like to ask Chief DeHatter any questions on this? |
| 00:16:23.03 | Mary Wagner | I couldn't see the figures for the |
| 00:16:25.31 | Herb Weiner | You have to come up to the mic and identify yourself, please. Thank you. Yeah, just come right up to the mic. |
| 00:16:32.94 | Mary Wagner | I couldn't see the figures. |
| 00:16:36.70 | Herb Weiner | Yeah, you got to. Yeah, no, over there. |
| 00:16:40.09 | Mary Wagner | Oh, |
| 00:16:41.27 | Herb Weiner | Now you understand. |
| 00:16:42.59 | John Fasanis | Yeah. |
| 00:16:42.64 | Herb Weiner | Well, now you're on TV. |
| 00:16:44.68 | John Fasanis | Yeah, John Fasanis, and I was just... I was interested in the numbers up there that were shown in the columns for the hours because I couldn't see them in the back. and I... I was just trying to stand. |
| 00:16:57.63 | Johnston Malbastad | I was just trying to send the cost. |
| 00:17:08.33 | Unknown | Thank you. |
| 00:17:08.44 | Jerry Fate | So there is. |
| 00:17:08.83 | Unknown | There is no additional cost to the city for this program right now. |
| 00:17:22.03 | Unknown | I think it's 15. |
| 00:17:28.61 | Unknown | Is that the one? |
| 00:17:29.54 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:17:31.16 | Unknown | So we went from eight and a half hours in January. Can you see them from there? Would you like me to read them? Thank you. And this is... an estimate. of hours that were recorded. |
| 00:17:52.32 | Herb Weiner | 42. |
| 00:17:53.33 | Unknown | 42. |
| 00:17:56.71 | John Fasanis | here. Thank you. you Thank you. the stories, the coverage. Thank you. |
| 00:18:03.49 | Unknown | Do you want to come up here and see? |
| 00:18:05.03 | John Fasanis | Thank you. So this includes the amount of hours I'm going to do with the coverage of this story, with the newspapers. I remember reading about this in the Marin IJ. and the fact that it was, the purpose was basically to offer a Um, Healthy Human Services to the anchor outs And I also read the number of arrests that were made having to do with the searching of a number of the boats, and I think there was two arrests, I'm not sure, I think there were misdemeanor charges One fellow had, I think, a gun on board. But I could be wrong. I'm not sure. |
| 00:18:44.45 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 00:18:46.32 | John Fasanis | if the chief could elaborate. |
| 00:18:51.74 | Unknown | So if I'm correct, you have two questions. How much time was spent with the press on this? I think we spent an hour and a half with them last week. And then we did find in one of the operations, I think two weapons on board one of the boats. |
| 00:19:12.71 | Mary Wagner | Yes, sir. |
| 00:19:13.83 | Herb Weiner | Go ahead, Tom. |
| 00:19:16.63 | Tom Hoover | Bye. Tom Hoover, 300 Napa Street. My question would be simply, Tom from New York. |
| 00:19:22.84 | Jonathan Leone | You just asked a question up here. |
| 00:19:24.41 | Tom Hoover | Oh, I'm sorry. The question is, in entering on the boats, what sort of warrant is required in order to enter into these people's thing? Just sort of I wanted to find out the strict legality of what went on for that. |
| 00:19:42.65 | Unknown | To enter someone's boat, it depends on what agency is doing it and what their purpose is. So for us, we would need probable cause to go on there, and the U.S. Coast Guard has a different set of requirements for them to board a boat. So it depends. Each case is approached on its own merit. But we treat it as if it's someone's home. So we can't just go on there because we want to go on there. The Coast Guard has a little bit more leeway than we do. |
| 00:20:22.69 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Any other questions? Go ahead. We'll come up. |
| 00:20:26.74 | Johnston Malbastad | Welcome up. Thank you. |
| 00:20:28.87 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 00:20:28.90 | Johnston Malbastad | Say your name. I'm Johnston Malbastad, and I live at Bridgeway Marine, foot of Locust. I'm grateful that the police have sort of taken the ball and run with it a little bit, because where I live on my boat, I am on the side of the channel where many of the anchorouts go by in their dinghies, sort of for their egress and ingress to and from the shore at the dock next to Paradise Bay, what used to be called Paradise Bay, the foot of Johnson Street. And I'm pretty much on Johnson Street, the submerged portion there where my boat is tied up at the marineways. And the incident of people speeding and not complying to the speed limit and leaving a huge wake and people working on their outboard motors at the launch ramp or doing whatever. I've been there for three years and it was kind of a nightmare because these guys would come ashore and start working on their outboards at 3 in the morning and they'd start yelling at each other. became a hotspot for people to hang out and work on their boats. And I was kind of like, well, as well as speeding in and out and creating a wake and disturbing everybody in that neighborhood. And then when you ask them respectfully, they would either flip you off or worse. And so I'm very happy that something has happened because there's been a huge reduction in the number of those kind of incidents. It's almost nonexistent these days. So what I'm saying is it's been incredibly effective. Just the absence is stunning. I can sleep through the whole night now. It's really great. And so my appreciation goes out to them. |
| 00:22:03.13 | Bob Dar | So, |
| 00:22:07.05 | Johnston Malbastad | And also, you know, any, I mean it's ridiculous that we didn't have a waterfront patrol, totally ridiculous. And I know that it's really RBRA's responsibility to be doing this stuff. If the RBRA, had been effective in exercising the mandate that it was set up to do. this probably wouldn't be an issue. And I don't know where all the money has gone, but it certainly hasn't gone to enforcing the, the legal requirement of what the RBRA was set up to do. That's all I have to say. Thank you very much. |
| 00:22:38.97 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. Anybody else from the public? Okay, Jennifer. Oh, I'm sorry. We'll bring it back up here for any comments. |
| 00:22:43.04 | Jonathan Leone | Jennifer. Oh, I'm sorry. So the RBRA is not an enforcement agency for legal, for criminal activity. And the city actually has ceded some of its authority to the RBRA on certain other areas. Right. But in the RBRA's budget, it's a couple hundred thousand dollars. So, and part of that vote is paid for by the RBRA. So, half of it is paid for by the RBRA. So, the – but I – there certainly is a value to stepping up our enforcement of the laws on the water. I would also ask the Chief to keep in mind that some of these other |
| 00:23:32.97 | Jonathan Leone | issues that you bring up, environmental things, those are within the boundary of the RBRA, not the police department, certainly. And I would ask you to be, as you said, treated like someone's home, because the impression that has existed out there over the years is that that is not the case. But there's certainly an element out there that deserves to be watched closely. There's no doubt about that. |
| 00:23:38.53 | Bob Dar | um, |
| 00:23:59.65 | Jonathan Leone | Okay. |
| 00:24:00.03 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 00:24:00.97 | Unknown | I'd just like to add that we do work in partnership with Bill Price, and recently he's trained our officers into how to identify hazardous conditions and what actions to take in terms of citations and warnings. So we are actually doing that to assist him. |
| 00:24:19.97 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Thank you. |
| 00:24:20.65 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor? Yes. I just wanted to make a comment to, I applaud Chief Tejeda's efforts in, first of all, designating this as a beat three and just really treating this situation with sensitivity and with respect. And as for the environment, your efforts with partnering with RVRA to get the training you need, I think the environment is something we can all |
| 00:24:21.19 | Herb Weiner | Yes. |
| 00:24:48.19 | Jonathan Leone | we all need to care about and it's been a silent victim. too long out on the bay. So thank you very much and thank your team for everything that they're doing. |
| 00:25:00.42 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Jennifer, thank you very, very much. |
| 00:25:07.34 | Herb Weiner | Okay, this time here, we're going to have comments from the public on items that are not on our agenda. Um, Basco, would you like to start off please? |
| 00:25:21.14 | Vasco Marais | Thank you very much, Council and Mayor. My name is Vasco Marais. I'm the president of the Portuguese Hall on Caledonia Street. Many of you have been there at the hall, and you've celebrated our festas. Manuel Isredo has got a great restaurant up in Sonoma, a Portuguese restaurant. Our vice president is here as well. We're here because we would like to propose a sister city with a Portuguese city. I've handed out packets to all of you. I'm actually going to give one to the chief The chief has actually been to the city |
| 00:26:02.57 | Vasco Marais | Very fortuitous because we were talking about Cais. It's spelled C-A-S-C-A-I-S, but the Portuguese have a lot of kind of sounds. So it's actually Cais. So you all may know the Portuguese have been in Sausalito for many, many years. I think they first came in the 1850s. The U.S. Census Bureau of Statistics for 1900 at the turn of the century, Sausalito was 25% Portuguese. We are going to be celebrating our 125th continuous festa at the hall. Actually, the first one was on the other end of Caledonia Street. There was a shopkeeper called Lorenzo, and he did the first one in 1886. There's an article in the Sausalito News. So we have this long, long, continuous relationship with Sausalito, and it seems totally appropriate that we add to the two sister cities that Sausalito currently has, a city in Portugal. So at the mayor's suggestion, I was in Portugal last summer in the city of Cascais, where I'm from, and I met with some city officials there, and they were just bowled over that I had come in because they have, I think, about eight sister city relationships, but none in the United States. And they've been approached by Pittsburgh, and they said, oh, Pittsburgh, and then I came in, and I said, Sausalito. And there's just so many similarities between Sausalito and Qashqai. It's a suburb of a larger city. There's a bridge that looks exactly like the Golden Gate Bridge. It's just north to it. It's a very attractive place to live, and I think this is something really worth pursuing. So I'm not going to go into a lot of detail. A lot of the information is in the past. in the packets that I sent to you that you all have. I would really like you all to consider this. There are two imminent deadlines. This city, Kishkaish, as I said, has really, really been excited about this prospect, and they've been emailing me, the council member from the city, Kishkaish, and he actually would like us to get back, and it's been my delay because I've just been really busy with hall activities as my role as president, and there is a conference coming up in June. The city has been invited to attend the conference, and anyway, that's my three minutes, so anyway, thank you all. Thank you, Professor. |
| 00:28:30.45 | Bert Ravnus | Thank you. |
| 00:28:31.95 | Herb Weiner | Okay, any other? |
| 00:28:36.72 | Bert Ravnus | Hi, good evening, Bert Ravnus, 45 Anchorage Road. Mr. Mayor, fellow council members, my purpose of addressing you this evening is to correct something that occurred at the last council meeting. At approximately one hour and 35 minutes of the last council meeting, Councilman Kelly, you stated emphatically that no exclusive negotiating agreement or ENA existed. Do you remember that statement? |
| 00:29:06.07 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 00:29:06.09 | Bert Ravnus | Thank you. |
| 00:29:06.19 | Herb Weiner | that he... |
| 00:29:07.03 | Bert Ravnus | you, |
| 00:29:07.37 | Herb Weiner | You can't. |
| 00:29:08.03 | Bert Ravnus | Oh, okay. Also at the same time, Ron Albert from Rotary Housing stated that there was no project that they had considered for Butte-Lincoln. |
| 00:29:08.08 | Herb Weiner | Oh, okay. |
| 00:29:20.67 | Bert Ravnus | I'd like to pass this out to you, Annette, please. |
| 00:29:29.49 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:29:43.11 | Bert Ravnus | On the second page, City Attorney Wagner, is that your signature? |
| 00:29:48.63 | Mary Wagner | Oh, you can't. |
| 00:29:49.40 | Bert Ravnus | Oh, you can't. Okay. I'm sorry. My mistake. On the second page, there is a signature from the city attorney and from the city manager. And attached to this is a draft, the exclusive negotiating agreement. And I'd like to set the record straight that... |
| 00:29:50.60 | Mary Wagner | I'm sorry. |
| 00:30:07.65 | Bert Ravnus | This document did exist. It was on the agenda. It was slated to be approved without any public comment. And through the efforts of certain people to make us aware of this residence, it is here, and I'd like to just read here, Rotary Housing has reached an agreement with Hunt to purchase Hunt's interest in the site. Rotary is also interested in acquiring the City's one-half interest in the site for purpose of developing an affordable and or senior residential development project. I'm not the sharpest hack in the box, but I wasn't born at night, especially not last night. It seems to me that Rotary would not have entered an agreement to purchase this land and approach the city unless they were very confident and actually had a plan. Um, And, you know, I just wanted to set the record straight that this document did exist, and it is here for the record, and that's all I have to say. |
| 00:31:07.57 | Herb Weiner | Okay, thank you. Any other comments from the public? Thank you. on items that are not on the agenda. Okay. And we'll bring it back up here and move for the approval of the minutes of the regular council meeting of October 18th. |
| 00:31:24.80 | Mike Kelly | So move. |
| 00:31:26.40 | Herb Weiner | Okay, all in favor? Aye. |
| 00:31:28.21 | Mike Kelly | All right. |
| 00:31:28.66 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 00:31:29.76 | Mike Kelly | Thank you. |
| 00:31:29.96 | Carolyn Ford | I reckon. |
| 00:31:30.54 | Herb Weiner | Okay, all in favor? Aye. Opposed? Okay, thank you. All right, moving next to the consent calendar. |
| 00:31:31.63 | Carolyn Ford | Bye. |
| 00:31:39.21 | Carolyn Ford | Mr. Mayor? Yes. I would like to pull 4B, Cypress Ridge, open space issue. |
| 00:31:39.89 | Herb Weiner | Yes |
| 00:31:49.20 | Herb Weiner | Um... Yeah, why don't we move that to the next meeting? That would be perfect. Thank you. Is that okay? Do we have a consensus on that to the next meeting? Yes. Okay. Okay. All right. Then we'll take that out. And now... Mr. Mayor. Yes. |
| 00:31:55.12 | Mary Wagner | That would be perfect. Thank you. |
| 00:32:02.09 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. |
| 00:32:05.21 | Jonathan Leone | Then we'll... Thank you. Mr. Mayor? I actually have a question about 4F, the Finance and OMIT Committee meeting notes. |
| 00:32:21.94 | Herb Weiner | Yes. |
| 00:32:25.62 | Jonathan Leone | I have a question about this. I'm not sure if this is the time to ask it, but I was curious looking at the topics, what the criteria is, for, uh, placing items on the Finance Committee |
| 00:32:41.33 | Herb Weiner | that can finance our own it. |
| 00:32:44.01 | Jonathan Leone | Well, actually both. Okay. I mean, OMIT seems like there's at least a little bit more of a charter, although I think that sometimes that's a little loosey-goosey. But I look at the Finance Committee and I see... |
| 00:32:45.55 | Herb Weiner | Okay. |
| 00:32:56.31 | Herb Weiner | Excuse me, that's not on the agenda. |
| 00:32:58.13 | Jonathan Leone | Well, the approval of the minutes is 4F for the finance and OMIT. Thank you. And so I'm commenting. It's just a minute. |
| 00:33:05.53 | Jonathan Leone | It's just a minute. It's not only on the minutes. |
| 00:33:09.63 | Jonathan Leone | All right. |
| 00:33:10.22 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:33:10.23 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:33:10.27 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:33:10.29 | Jonathan Leone | Okay, so I will hold my comment to future agenda items at the end of the meeting. |
| 00:33:10.51 | Jonathan Leone | Bye. |
| 00:33:10.57 | Herb Weiner | THE FAMILY IS |
| 00:33:13.86 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Okay, thank you. Then we have approval taking out 4B and approval of the consent calendar. I'm sorry, public comment on any of these consent items? Okay, bring it back up here. |
| 00:33:35.23 | Mary Wagner | Okay. |
| 00:33:35.62 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. Any questions? |
| 00:33:40.96 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. |
| 00:33:43.93 | Carolyn Ford | I move that we approve of the consent calendar with the exception of 4B and that we continue that to our very next meeting. |
| 00:33:54.72 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:33:54.75 | Mary Wagner | Okay. |
| 00:33:55.06 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:33:55.58 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:33:55.61 | Stan Baer | Thank you. Quick question. |
| 00:33:56.61 | Jonathan Leone | before you know there's a motion clarification on |
| 00:33:56.64 | Stan Baer | before you... |
| 00:34:05.48 | Jonathan Leone | C, question for the city manager. Is this in the current budget for vehicles? It is in this year. |
| 00:34:20.60 | Jonathan Leone | I don't second the motion. |
| 00:34:22.58 | Jonathan Leone | And Mr. Mayor? Yes. If I may, I have a quick question on item 4E regarding the transportation funding proposal with the city of San Rafael. I just want to confirm that this is a one-time swap, and I want to confirm that these funds will be targeted specifically for infrastructure road repair. |
| 00:34:23.95 | Jonathan Leone | Yes. |
| 00:34:24.32 | Fran Nelson | Thank you. |
| 00:34:44.21 | Jonathan Leone | and like projects that would initially have been funded by the MTC. because that was not clear from what I saw in the staff report. |
| 00:34:54.66 | Adam Politzer | That is my understanding that the city and the mayor can come. Thank you. |
| 00:34:57.43 | Jonathon Goldman | Todd. The agreement terms, what you see from the agreement terms is purely a first draft. We had asked them some questions like specifying where they might source their funds. You know, we're giving up our right to federal funds and they will give us 80 cents on the dollar. but they don't specify where their funds are going to be. |
| 00:35:35.29 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. Mm-hmm. |
| 00:35:38.85 | Jonathon Goldman | I would suggest you give direction to staff that those terms be included. Stipulation with regard to expenditures on transportation capital projects, and we'll make sure they're in there. |
| 00:35:40.83 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. direction. that those |
| 00:35:44.78 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:35:53.72 | Jonathan Leone | So |
| 00:35:55.31 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor, can I just point in order, if there's gonna be this much discussion, we should take it off the consent calendar and put it on the agenda. |
| 00:36:03.12 | Carolyn Ford | I would like to amend my motion for the consent calendar and suggest that we move that we hear in open session the Thank you. Thank you. item E, which is the transportation funding proposal with the city of San Rafael. |
| 00:36:24.40 | Herb Weiner | take that to the next meeting? Do we have an understanding? Or at the end of the... |
| 00:36:28.68 | Carolyn Ford | or at the end of the night? |
| 00:36:29.61 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:36:30.73 | Mike Kelly | Thank you. |
| 00:36:30.86 | Mary Wagner | you |
| 00:36:30.93 | Mike Kelly | Thank you. |
| 00:36:31.28 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:36:31.35 | Mike Kelly | Thank you. |
| 00:36:31.42 | Herb Weiner | Yeah, we'll take it to the next meeting. |
| 00:36:31.45 | Mike Kelly | Yeah. |
| 00:36:35.25 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. See you. Okay? |
| 00:36:38.45 | Jonathan Leone | Okay? Yes, just to clarify, the amended motion, that is for... |
| 00:36:44.72 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:36:44.77 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:36:44.97 | Mary Wagner | you |
| 00:36:45.02 | Jonathan Leone | approval items a see the And F, and continuing items B and E to the next meeting or date, I'm certain. Which would you rather? Next meeting? 15th. Okay. So I am supportive of that. |
| 00:37:05.03 | Herb Weiner | Okay, have a second. |
| 00:37:07.67 | Mary Wagner | I am the second. |
| 00:37:07.90 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 00:37:07.92 | Herb Weiner | I am the second. He's the second. Okay. All in favor? Aye. Okay, opposed? Okay. |
| 00:37:09.45 | Jonathan Leone | I just want to say that. |
| 00:37:10.65 | Mary Wagner | Hi. |
| 00:37:14.86 | Herb Weiner | All right, now let's go on to business items. Presentations, Heather and Richard on proposed Cass Marina property. |
| 00:38:07.13 | Heather Richard | Good evening. Thank you for having us back again after almost two years. I'm Heather Richard. I'm here to represent a group that is... How do I pause this for a second? I can't pause it. |
| 00:38:28.19 | Heather Richard | Can we go back to the main menu? Is there a way to do that? |
| 00:38:37.73 | Heather Richard | Okay, so... |
| 00:38:38.35 | Mary Wagner | So, |
| 00:38:39.85 | Heather Richard | Ah, okay. All right, so let's just auto run it in a second. Is that okay? So I'm here to represent a group that has been working really hard to come up with a great plan for a piece of city property. And the idea started... when We, most of us being neighbors living in Galilee Harbor next door to Casa Marina, saw the place just fall apart. And we were concerned about what was gonna go in there. And we said, wouldn't it be awesome if we could just have a community boating center for everybody that would be part of the Parks and Rec Department access for people who don't really have any other way to access the water. And then at the same time to preserve the maritime heritage and especially the boat building traditions of Sausalito, which are so strong. And, um, We felt that there are a lot of great boat builders in town and their work is not known and there's no place really to see their work outside of the Spalding Center. Um, But that's a working boat yard. It's not a place where people can go and actually get in a boat and go sailing or go rowing. And so we really felt like putting together something that tied the history and the current boat building tradition to the people of the city. in an interesting way and also gave youth, elderly, disabled people access to the water where they didn't have to necessarily have an expensive membership at a yacht club. or pay for, you know, sort of the upper end charter sailing lessons, but just really get in kind of at the ground level in small boats. That's what we were going for. And there are a lot of great programs in the country that do this, and so we've looked really hard at those programs. I grew up in one in Boston. I got to go sailing all summer long for a dollar. at Community Boating on the Charles River, which is just an amazing thing. Boston, the city of Boston worked really hard a long time ago to make that happen and it's been continuously running for almost 100 years now. And so I'd love to see a waterfront community like ours have something like that here. I think that this piece of property is the perfect place to do it. It's slightly sheltered. It's right on one of our existing parks that is used by locals mostly. And it already has some of the infrastructure needed. So what we're proposing would be something that Just sort of rebuilds the current footprint, not expanding what was there historically, But getting it up to code and making it ADA accessible and making it really easy to use. um, So let's go ahead and run the slideshow and I can kind of talk you through our mission. is using Good Friends Always Welcome, which was on the sign that we love, and it's still there, is to preserve the gathering place in Sausalito's unique waterfront community. to educate the public and make it through affordable and direct experience. Not a museum experience, but a direct experience and use of the water. So to advocate for environmental awareness, seamanship and safety, promote all of our traditional maritime crafts, and also be a venue where people can come and use the waterfront. We'd like to offer these things, free and low-cost youth sailing training programs, market rate, adult, and also senior programs. Using historic vessels. |
| 00:42:36.73 | Jonathan Leone | Have a... Do you want us to take it off the auto run so we don't have to speak as quickly? |
| 00:42:39.60 | Heather Richard | so you don't have to go. Well, I think, I mean, I can let you all read this as well, and it's on our website, but I'm just sort of highlighting what I think is most important here anyway. |
| 00:42:52.00 | Jonathan Leone | have to sprint through and keep up with the slides. So it's up to you. |
| 00:42:55.51 | Heather Richard | Yeah, we were close to the end of the time anyway. you So, The Archez School, the Spalding Center, and the San Francisco Maritime Museum have all been really eager to be partners with us in this. And I can let them speak a little bit in the public comment period about how that might work. But these are all the types of things that we'd like to see happen in this location. |
| 00:43:26.81 | Heather Richard | And I'm glad that the police chief is here tonight because I think that we could really work together to have a great place for her to do the training programs that she's starting to implement. It would work really well. So the most important thing is that we would be a nonprofit entity. and we would be a parks and recreation center. So we would raise the money to run and operate the center. And the Parks and Recreation Department would basically Um, support us in advertising and taking registrations for our programs. So we would run everything on the water. We would make sure the liability and the training and you know, Coast Guard certifications and all that stuff that cities don't know how to do is covered. and the Parks and Rec Department would put the classes in the magazine and take the registrations and take a fee so that they can cover their overhead for doing that. So. All of these programs that you're seeing here, community voting programs, work very, very similarly. Some do more, some do less, but they're basically all partnerships with the municipal parks and rec departments. And that seems to be a very good model. It seems to work well. I know that Mike Langford has worked with that exact model before, He's also worked with a model where the Parks and Rec Department runs the whole show. over at Lake Merritt in Oakland. We're not suggesting that we do that here. I think a nonprofit would do it better. in such a small town. and not have to depend on tax revenue. So we would be raising all of the money for the capital improvements. The city would then own those improvements in perpetuity. and the center would continue to maintain them in conjunction with the city. So, What we're asking for, basically, is for you to Um, send a recommendation to the OMIC committee to draft an intent to lease. The intent to lease would say, that we have um, A period of time that is reasonable for us to raise the capital necessary to get the Dachshund buildings back into code and to become ADA compliant. And then when the. Um, The money has been raised and we're ready to move forward. We do the improvements. and we take the amount of money that was raised to do that, and we spread it out over however long it would take us to have paid that off back at market rate rent. so that it gives us a little time to get up and running as a nonprofit. But the city wouldn't be taking a tremendous risk because we either raise the money or we don't raise the money in that period of time. And if we even raise most of it and get the improvements made to the docks and buildings, the city has moved ahead without any cost to the city just without having had a rent paying partner during that time, or tenant during that time. So that's what we're asking for tonight. These are the kids at the boat building program at the Spaulding Center. They have nowhere really great to sail the boats that they've been building. So we would like to be the location for these kids to come down and sail the boats they just built. And then for them to continue their boat building program knowing that there will be a venue those youth to learn to sail. on those boats that they've made. We also would love to showcase some of Bob Dar's boats that are being built at the Arkez School. And the Maritime Museum of San Francisco, these are pictures from some of their programs, has written this letter, which I just included. It was kind of last minute, because they've all been in Washington. fighting for their funding. the last few weeks, but they're very excited to really try to partner with us in putting six or seven boats in a rotating exhibit at the dock there to be used by the community. And they have a lot of boats that don't get used or seen by anybody. So those are some pictures of what the site looked like two years ago when we started working on this. I just couldn't bring myself to take new pictures because it's such a sad sight at the moment. So I would really love to see this get done before the America's Cup. And it would be really fun to see something like, a Qashqai Sister City program where the America's Cup test event was just held, send some of their sailors to do a reciprocal event here in Sausalito where the America's Cup will be held in 2013. So I would love to see that kind of thing happening. for our waterfront here. A little quick word about the police and fire boats as well. If we get this done, when we get this done, we would be ADA compliant, which would mean that we'd have a really great ramp for them to bring people on and off the dock, you know, on a stretcher. So if there were rescues, anything like that happening, we would be able to provide a permanent berth for those boats. If they wanted them to be there, they would have better access, ADA compliance-wise, to the water, and they'd be right next to Dunphy Park. And we've already heard mentioned that that's a bit of a tough spot for the police to manage and monitor. So that's something I'd love to provide at the center, is to be able to tuck the police and fire boats right up against these docks here where |
| 00:49:03.61 | Bob Dar | Okay. |
| 00:49:17.16 | Heather Richard | where there used to be, this was taken a couple years ago, where there used to be docs all the way out to the end. would be a nice permanent home for them if that's where they would like to be. And it could be done, that could also be given rent free. These are Bob Dyer's boats down at the Arkez program. So this is what you might see at the docks once we get up and running. and might be able to come down and learn how to sail on. And then this was the boat that Cass Gidley and his wife Mary, who is here on our board, set off on years ago when this place was first built. So really quickly before I finish up, and their family. So really quickly, I want to introduce our board so you have some faces to go with the names in your packet. Mary is here. Mary Gidley is here. And she's just a wonderful historical resource as well as a great editor and just wholeheartedly behind this project. Kathy Steerhop is sitting next to her. She's a local volunteer and retired CPA and a sailor, and she's been wonderfully helpful in getting the numbers to look good, and CJ Spady is not here tonight. but she has also taken over as our treasurer And she's also been a wonderful asset to the organization and can help us really get our finances correct Anton Hotner is here and he's a local boat builder. He was at the Arcez School, studied under Bob Dar, and is now doing his own thing. And Inka Pearson's also a local boat builder, and she's teaching the Spalding program as well. And Stephanie Wicks is here, and she's a local historian and photographer and resident of Galilee Harbor as well. And this is our board, so now you kind of know who we are. And then I'm sure during the public comment period, there'll be a few more people who We'll stand up and talk about partnering with us potentially. |
| 00:51:15.60 | Adam Politzer | Mr. Mayor, Heather, can you also mention you've been out in the community meeting with various groups. Can you mention some of the groups? And obviously there's some letters of support that are in the packet, but I think that would be also helpful for... |
| 00:51:16.72 | Bob Dar | Yes. |
| 00:51:30.82 | Adam Politzer | the council and the community here, the efforts that you've taken to meet with community supporters and interested bodies. |
| 00:51:39.04 | Heather Richard | Yeah, so I... I sail professionally, so I'm tied in with the charter companies and the commercial sailing schools in the Bay, and also the yacht clubs. And so I've reached out to all of them at some point in the last two years, if not just recently, but just over the course of this to kind of get their input. and as well as SEA, which is the only other sort of non-profit sailing school We've been working, you know, on and off with them, too. And then I recently reached out to the Friends of Dunphy Park and had some meetings with them about what their concerns were, parking and bathrooms and the nitty gritty of getting the master plan for Dumpy Park to work well with what we're planning on doing and not being behind the curve and pushing things forward before we're ready to deal with parking and bathrooms and all of that. And I think they now understand that I really would like to see the whole master plan worked out. I don't want it to slow us down in getting this piece done because of the America's Cup coming and the increased traffic on the waterfront that we're going to have, I'm very, conscientious and happy. happy to work with them on the parking issues especially. Um, And we've reached out a little bit to the cruising club, and we've reached out to Bob Licht of Sea Trek, kayaking center to sort of see how their needs can be worked in a little bit with what we're doing. THE FAMILY IS a bunch of nonprofit groups as well. There are a couple of groups that get disabled people out on the water that we've been in touch with to figure out what they're going to require, what they'd like to see, if we could fit it in. And I've also been going to all the America's Cup Youth Program meetings to see what, if anything, will come out of money for youth programs from the America's Cup Organizing Committee. There's going to be a pretty good trickle-down effect when the America's Cup is over. There will be funds and equipment available. to programs that are up and running by then. So we have, you know, a big push to do that if we can. and it will probably pay off pretty well. I hope I'm not missing anybody. But, yeah. |
| 00:54:20.97 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Do we have any questions up here from the Council for Heather? Yeah, I'll go to them. Yes. |
| 00:54:27.76 | Carolyn Ford | I'll go to them. I do, Mr. Mayor. Will there be a need for dredging with this project? |
| 00:54:35.65 | Heather Richard | Not immediately. That's why we chose to make it a small boat program. So the boats that we are planning on using will fit in the existing space with the amount of water there is. A maintenance dredging permit was Still active when Lois was running everything two years ago. I don't know how long those last. And I've talked with Bill Price extensively about it. He's the other person I've reached out to a lot, and he and I have been working together to assess the pilings, the dredging situation, the current docks that are usable versus not usable and all of that. So the answer is immediately, no. Can we last five to eight years without dredging? Yes. Can we last much beyond that? I don't know. Probably not. So eventually, yeah. |
| 00:55:25.13 | Carolyn Ford | So, Thank you. |
| 00:55:26.74 | Heather Richard | Thank you. |
| 00:55:27.22 | Carolyn Ford | . Thank you. |
| 00:55:27.73 | Heather Richard | AND, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT |
| 00:55:27.97 | Carolyn Ford | And how do you see the charters integrating with the small boat operation, with the kayaks and the sailboats, et cetera? |
| 00:55:37.97 | Heather Richard | So this is something that we've spent some time thinking about. I certainly have because I'm a charter captain and I do that for a living. So there are There are issues of parking if you bring in large numbers of people. and There are not a lot of issues with parking if you just bring in small numbers of people. It wouldn't necessarily increase the amount of use for the facility if we were to limit the charters that could come in and out to six-pack charters, for example, which means that it's an uninspected vessel and it can carry six passengers or less. If we were to open it up to the larger charters initially without a parking plan, we may need to require them to shuttle people in and out of the site, or have people park in the public lots that are available and walk. So I think that we'll have to deal with that. in conjunction with the Parks and Rec Department and the Friends of Dunphy Park and their ideas about what to do with that parking and how quickly that gets developed or not developed. Thank you. |
| 00:56:46.74 | Alison Thornberry | Amen. |
| 00:56:58.40 | Herb Weiner | Okay, any other questions here? Okay, from the public, are there any questions on this item? Someone? |
| 00:57:06.06 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 00:57:07.68 | Herb Weiner | How many people would like to get up to speak on this item? |
| 00:57:11.26 | Mary Wagner | Oh, boy. |
| 00:57:11.78 | Herb Weiner | Ooh. |
| 00:57:11.82 | Mary Wagner | you |
| 00:57:12.84 | Herb Weiner | Okay, then what I would like you to do is, for the sake of time, I'd like you to line up so we don't have to keep on waiting for you to come up. Okay. Okay, go ahead. State your name. Thank you. |
| 00:57:29.18 | John Fasanis | Please. |
| 00:57:29.20 | Herb Weiner | Please. |
| 00:57:30.06 | John Fasanis | John Posadas. Amran Taxi. Um... I, uh... I'm really excited about this plan for the CASC House Marina. because I came here today to put on the agenda for the next meeting. a proposal to relaxed ordinance against Water taxis. We want to offer a water taxi service, which will also be ADA compliant. And, um, At the moment, she was talking about shuttle problems. We're taxicab drivers, and a number of us that are wishing to put together this proposal that will air before this committee. the next session. But I'm excited. She's got a great idea. and also preparing the dock by the by Dunphy Park. Um, is perfect. for our uses. Amen. I'll bring it up in the next minute, though. Thank you. |
| 00:58:43.77 | Bob Dar | Hello, I'm Bob Dar, the director of the Arkes School. having sailed this waterfront for nearly 60 years and having lived here for about 55 years. I think this is one of the best ideas that I've heard in all of that time. especially because the people that are proposing it are actually qualified to make it happen. The one thing they may have a little trouble with, possibly, is raising money. We all have trouble raising money. But I know a lot of these people, and they're hardworking, they're down to earth, they love the community, and it's that dedication and love that I think would need to be there to make the project last and endure for all of the time it would take to really put it together. Also I'm here to to confirm the statement that the Archez School is interested in putting some of its votes into this program once it becomes established. So I strongly recommend this project to you. Thank you. Thank you. |
| 00:59:44.59 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 00:59:44.97 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 00:59:45.21 | Herb Weiner | you |
| 00:59:48.58 | Andrea Ray | Hello, my name is Andrea Ray and I am the Associate Director at the Spaulding Wooden Boat Center. And the reason why the Spaulding Wooden Boat Center from the beginning decided to support this proposal is first because our missions align. Then, because we know the people, and we strongly believe that, as Bob Darce said, They are residents of South Salito. They are boat builders and of, they really know what they are doing. They may face some difficulties in fundraising money like any other nonprofit. I do think it's a very viable project. Uh, Another part that we were very interested in is the Spalding Center because we have been taking people sailing on the bay from our docks we take around 300 people a year. And unfortunately, we had to say, to a lot of people with physical disabilities because we don't have the capacity to take them to our boat. Another program that we have is the Youth Boat Building and Sailing Program. We have to take our students to take sailing classes outside of the Spaulding Center And one of the main reasons is because we don't have a safe basin where they can practice. Our place is very small. The water space we have is very small. And we do produce three boats a year through our Youth Boat Building Program. So our partnership with the CAS Marina will be to have our boats that have been built at the URT boat building program in their marina and use also the class marina is a way to pick up with our bigger boat Polaris people with physical disabilities and elderly as well. So thank you very much. |
| 01:02:11.74 | Michael Rex | Hello, I'm Michael Rex and I'm speaking as the president of the Richardson's Bay Maritime Association. We call it the RBMA. And, Our BMA was founded by Barry Hibben and Charlie Merrill and Cameron Dorsey. And our mission is to preserve maritime heritage of Richardson's Bay. And we've decided the best way to do that is to Um, keep open and maintain the existing water-oriented uses here in town. and Cascale Marina. we think is one of the best ways to preserve Cass Marina. Cass Marina is a special place. It's been well loved and a part of our community for the last 50 years, and we want to encourage its preservation. What is before you is a community-based approach. You don't have an outside, out-of-towner developer coming in or something. We have the community coming to you, asking to partner with you and seeking your help. It's consistent with Dunphy Park Plan 5B. You may remember that. That's our only official plan. And if you look at it, dust it off. It actually calls for a small boat recreational facility there, even a boathouse. The RBMA agreed to provide, to be the fiscal sponsor for Cass Gidley Marina until they form their 501. We're currently holding $5,000 in funds that they are using as seed money to raise additional funds and once they become a 501, we'll continue to support their activities as a project of the RBMA. And we've done so because we have confidence in Heather, We're impressed by her and her dedication and her sense of responsibility. We're impressed by the board she's put together. We know them. We're glad that she put a CPA on her board because the money's going to be important. What's proposed here is a public-private partnership. You, the city, will provide the land, the lease, and continue to own the facilities and the improvements that the private parties will make. Cascale Marina will provide the funding, manage all the programs, and maintain the boats and docks. What a win-win. There's an opportunity here before us to preserve and promote Salcido's maritime traditions and uses There's an opportunity to enhance the recreational uses of Dunphy Park and improve its appearance. These are great things. This is the right use. This is the right people to do it. And they're asking something very simple right now. I ask that you do this. You direct your own committee to prepare a letter of intent and draft a lease that can be brought back before you and the public for consideration. Thank you. |
| 01:05:06.16 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. Do you want to hold your applause, please? Thank you. |
| 01:05:13.02 | Bob Licht | I'm Bob Licht. I own Sea Trek Kayaking Center at Schoenmacher Point Marina. I've been there for the last 30 years, and I just want to express my support for this project and look forward to working with the marina in any way that makes sense for us. Thank you. |
| 01:05:34.61 | Vicki Nichols | Good evening, Nina Weiner and Councilmembers. My name is Vicki Nichols and I am a member of the original member of the Friends of Dunphy Park. So I would just like to confirm what Heather said. She did meet with us. She took us through a and thoughtful process of her plan. And aside from me speaking for the whole board, I would like to encourage you to move forward with not holding this plan up. I want to agree with Michael's points. I want to just reiterate her plan is well thought out. It's, she could not ask, answer, She had an answer for every question we had. It's been thoroughly anticipated. The work will be done by her group. It's just going to be improvement. And the last thing I'd like to say is before the WAM committee was economic vitality. We had the precursor in the smaller groups, and I chaired the waterfront support group i think it was anyway One of the things that the community felt the strongest was maintaining this small maritime heritage through exact venues like this. So this would be a perfect example of the way that the city could partner with this project and do that. And I hope you will go forward with the letter of intent and not hold her up. the collectively the friends of Dunphy Mark Park is very interested in getting the master plan together. But I'm going to be a little bit of a rebel on that one and speak independently. I don't want her project held up. So I hope you'll agree to move forward with it. |
| 01:07:12.09 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 01:07:12.14 | Jack Myshock | Okay. Thank you. |
| 01:07:17.56 | Jack Myshock | Council people, my name is Jack Myshock. I am the managing partner of Modern Sailing School and Club here in Sausalito. We are a for-profit sailing school. And I've had the pleasure of working with Heather for two years now. And I just want to speak to her professionalism and her dedication to the sailing community. She is the right person to put this together. We typically teach adults, and the yacht clubs typically teach the younger kids. So there's a real void between the younger kids and the adults. And I think Heather's program is the perfect program to get those kids in between to come out and start sailing. And I think it's going to be a real valuable asset to the Sausalito. So I really hope you continue with the letter of intent and support her completely. Thank you. |
| 01:08:06.51 | Jerry Fate | Hi, I'm Jerry Fate. I live at Sausalito Marine, which is a neighbor of Cass Marina, and I think it sounds like a great idea. I support it. I have a question about the proposal for the Sausalito Cruising Club. I think that Heather's proposal, the master plan for Dunphy Park and the WAM proposal and of moving the cruising club and the fact that the |
| 01:08:09.91 | Alison Thornberry | I'm sorry. |
| 01:08:37.40 | Jerry Fate | America's Cup is coming to Sausalito. It's going to bring a lot of attention to this bar that sits on a barge on public property. And I just have a, I would like to have a resolution to what's going to happen to that before this Heather's plan is approved. Thank you. |
| 01:08:58.37 | Bob Licht | Okay. |
| 01:08:58.59 | Stan Baer | Thank you. Hi, my name is Stan Baer and I'm a resident. I live at 1713 Bridgeway. |
| 01:09:02.15 | Bob Licht | My name's Steve. |
| 01:09:08.85 | Stan Baer | I just wanted to voice my strongest support for this program. I've got young kids and the aspect of connecting the educational part of this program to a bigger plan for starting there and potentially the whole marine ship. I think it's exciting to me because I think we need a place to start, and I think the city holds the key here. And so I would say, here's the place we want to think about, you know, starting whatever's gonna happen afterwards. Thank you. That's all I have to say. And I think that's a good thing. |
| 01:09:57.03 | Paul Dines | you |
| 01:10:00.49 | Paul Dines | Good evening, Councilman. My name is Paul Dines. Most of you know me. I'm a mariner on the waterfront and I couldn't be prouder of the community from which I've come and the presentation they've made to you tonight. And as I understand it, you are being asked to give direction to the OMIT committee to enter into an intent to lease. And so I would strongly support that sort of emotion tonight. I would, as that sort of emotion tonight. I would, as you guys know, when Lois was just finishing up her tenure at the marina, we entered into some negotiations with her in hopes of buying the business. And there were some struggles and in the end it didn't come to be, but there were some things we discovered. One of them was that When Lois acquired the permits to replace the pilings and piers that are there and also have some maintenance dredging done, those permits expired in 2013. If those permits expire, it would potentially cost a half a million dollars to reacquire the permits. And so there's an imperative on the city in regards to the manner in which the lease is negotiated as to whether that dredging would take place in a time as to take advantage of those permits that are still in place and I myself advocate very strongly for Heather's program but on one small point where she would prefer to see smaller uninspected passenger vessels we feel the maritime community benefits from a lot of good jobs that are licensed Mariners and a small community organization that has a small footprint is valuable but you know to pay for all the repairs and improvements and even pay rent to the city requires servicing debt requires cash flow, and the commercial fleet is something that I'd like to see included if there's a way when that comes before the OMIT committee. you Thank you very much. |
| 01:11:57.16 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 01:11:57.20 | Mary Wagner | Okay. |
| 01:12:00.76 | Paul Dines | Thank you. |
| 01:12:00.77 | Herb Weiner | Yes, yeah, Heather. Come up to the podium, please. |
| 01:12:06.09 | Heather Richard | Thank you. I also feel that it would be beneficial for the city of Sausalito to have a public pier that can handle all forms of charter boats. I just want to make sure that we get the parking and the bathroom situation figured out so that I mean, I live right next door. A lot of people in this room live very nearby. And I want to make sure we do it right. So I wouldn't be opposed, and it would raise an awful lot of funds to put an awful lot of young kids out there on the water if we could bring in, you know, bigger passenger vessels and have that be a drop-off pickup site. I'm not saying I don't want that to happen, but I want us to do this right, and I want to do it in the right order. And if we're not ready to deal with the parking and the bathrooms yet, then let's just get started with a small boat program and move towards that. So to answer Paul, I want to make sure that that piece of it is clear what our intentions |
| 01:13:08.78 | Herb Weiner | Okay, thank you. Any other comments from the public? Okay, we'll bring it back up here. Any comments? proposals. |
| 01:13:21.00 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 01:13:21.01 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 01:13:21.03 | Jonathan Leone | No, I'm looking. I'm looking on both sides. Yeah, I think these guys are waiting for me to go, but I think the, so they can go last, but the, I think, you know, I think Jonathan, certainly Jonathan Goldman, our public director, can file for some extensions on the permits there, because it's certainly in the city's best interest. and we did so recently on some other parts of the waterfront. I think this is a, you know, Heather, I know you've been, there you are. Yes, it has been a long time, but, I know you've been... There you are. Yes, it has been a long time, but you've gotten your ducks in a row versus when we first started talking about this, and that's very important, especially when dealing with the public asset. So I think, you know, this is a pro... It was what this land was used for previously to some degree, and it makes sense to continue to provide that service to the public. You've got a lot of challenges ahead of you, as you well know. But I think you're probably the right... got the right group of people and the right energy to try and pull it off, and that's a great thing. To me, I am wholeheartedly in support of your concept, and you've done the right work to put it all together. I don't think the master, personally I'm not supportive of a master plan for Dunphy Park at the current moment in time. I think the central waterfront is more appropriate for a general plan concept. of dealing with all those open water lots. So I don't think it should wait for your project, and I can't see your project not being included in any planning in that area of the waterfront anyway. The issue of the cruising club is a thorny issue. I believe they're on a month-to-month lease at the moment. If we wanted to have fun, we'd have a hearing about the cruising club, affordable housing, and something else on the same night, and then we'd have a we'd have a full house and a lot of fighting so the but I think that's an issue that will come into play at some point whether a bar on the waterfront is a good thing on a city on city property but that being said I'm wholeheartedly in support what you're doing I think the city can be creative in ways to help you out and certainly can be helpful in helping you raise the money that you need, you know, going forward in terms of supporting you in talking to people to giving you money. And we also have the right infrastructure now to help you with the construction that's going to be happening. We have the right people working here, which we didn't two years ago. So that's a big difference, to actually plan and pull off a project like repairing those docks. So that's my support of what you're doing. |
| 01:16:07.35 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor? So I would agree. I think it's very exciting to see this proposal. Sausalito is a maritime town and this is an opportunity to promote that. highlight wooden boat craftsmanship and offer the services to youth and our seniors and our adults as well. And I agree that it probably makes sense to start small and get that success in place. And I, when I, I think that if, to start with, I, I, I'm, I'm fearful that going into the, the, the big, the big charters might, you know, swallow the, you know, might, might take too, too much of a, of the pie of this, of this organization. So I like the idea of starting small and getting that success. And I just want to commend everybody who's been a part of this and who's just banded together and Heather. It's just really exciting to see this. And I thank you and I thank all of you. And I think the slogan up there says it all. Good friends always welcome. It's a good team. Welcome. Thank you. |
| 01:17:36.37 | Carolyn Ford | Yes. Well, I would... I would like to say that there are a lot of people in town who have enjoyed Casa Marina over the years who have taken lessons there and it's wonderful to see that we have a plan and Heather that you've put this together so that we have a plan to continue with the sailing classes and get more people involved. And I like your piece about bringing the environmental issues into the program as well. I think that having the small boats there and bringing the people down to the park to be there is perfect. It adds to the ambience of the park and why we have a park. I am a little concerned about the charter boats and of course you are too with the parking and the bathrooms and everything, the commercialization of that area. I don't think commerce and parks necessarily go together. So I would be very in how that is put together and how just exactly. We'd like to see how that's going to work. I am delighted that you have two CPAs on the board, and I know they both have very good reputations. I would like to see the city go forward with an intent to lease, and I would like to see in the lease agreement a goal for when we decide and how we decide that the organization is going to be financially viable. So thank you very much for your work. Thank all of you for being here tonight to express support. I think it's really, really nice to see the community come together on a project like this. It feels great. So thank you. |
| 01:19:43.22 | Mike Kelly | After a couple of years of flirting with all kinds of different ideas for this, I think we've got the right plan. And Heather, you've done a great job. It's a responsible plan. It's emerging. It needs a good mix of things. And I think some commercial is necessary to make it viable. And so I support that. In terms of a public dock, I love that. I've been an advocate for a public dock for the entire. I've been on the council, and we haven't found the place or the funds to do it. So if we can start here, and that would be a good presentation. a good initiation. I'm impressed with the support and the organization that you put together and all the people that are supporting you, the organizations that are supporting, so I think you've got real firm base and they'll help with fundraising and so on. I think we shouldn't delay. We should move forward as rapidly as we can in all good organization and so on. Restrooms, parking, these are places where the city can help out. There's been a threat to put a restroom in Dunphy Park for as long as I've been here. So maybe we can make that come true. There's some funds available in various little pockets here and there. The city, I think, has a responsibility to step up and put some infrastructure in. So I'll support that and see if we can't find the money somewhere and help you raise money to do the accoutrement around it. So I think this is a great opportunity. |
| 01:21:04.10 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor? Thank you. May I add? |
| 01:21:07.25 | Mike Kelly | Sure. |
| 01:21:07.30 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. In the interest of streamlining this, actually, I'm wondering why it would go to OMIT. Why not just direct staff to work on the lease and bring this back to council? |
| 01:21:25.31 | Herb Weiner | one. |
| 01:21:25.80 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:21:27.37 | Herb Weiner | No, in fact, let me go to my comment. Heather, I think you're right on. I think you have really done your homework, and I fully support this. And I'd like to see and hopefully help you get the funds that you need and let the funds determine of what we can do or what you can do down there, whether it's commercial or not. I mean, that will be on the, I'm sure will be depending on the funding and I think that, It's way overdue. So thank you very much. And without you, I don't think this would have even gotten off the ground. So thank you, Heather. Okay. We have a... |
| 01:22:18.06 | Carolyn Ford | I think we have further comment. I would like to follow up on Council Member Pfeiffer's comment. I would like to see this brought back to Council and any questions. |
| 01:22:18.30 | Herb Weiner | of motion. |
| 01:22:30.78 | Carolyn Ford | any issues in the agenda discussed in public and to make sure that everyone has the chance to comment on the various pieces of this. So whether that goes to OMINT first or not, I want to see it come back to Council. |
| 01:22:55.34 | Herb Weiner | Okay, well, I think the proposal tonight is to have it go to OMIT and move it along. So can we... Thank you. Yes. |
| 01:23:05.66 | Adam Politzer | Mr. Mayor, maybe I can help there. Just to remind the council and the public on the process, The OMIT committee is really just a sounding board, so it's an opportunity for us to meet with Heather and her other representatives and have a discussion about what we've heard tonight based on some of the recommendations, put that in the letter of intent. OMIT would review that, and then we would then bring that back to the full council. OMIT, as many know, doesn't have the authority to enter into any agreement, only the full council does. So it's just an opportunity to stay the path that we've been in with Heather over the last couple years, where she comes in, checks in with the OMIT committee, talks about their needs, our needs, and reflect on what was shared tonight, bring that back to the Council for their full consideration. |
| 01:23:58.92 | Herb Weiner | Okay. So with that. |
| 01:24:03.04 | Jonathan Leone | I'll make a motion to not let politics in the middle of this and just have it make a motion to direct us to the OMIC committee for discussions with Heather and her board to come up with a lease proposal to take back to the full council. |
| 01:24:16.42 | Mike Kelly | Second. |
| 01:24:16.98 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 01:24:17.42 | Jonathan Leone | Okay. |
| 01:24:17.98 | Herb Weiner | All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Okay. Once again, Heather, thank you. |
| 01:24:18.65 | Mike Kelly | I'm sorry. |
| 01:24:23.21 | Mary Wagner | Bye. |
| 01:24:35.98 | Herb Weiner | Okay, let's move on to the next item, which is the direction on... I'm going to work. |
| 01:24:42.51 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 01:24:43.73 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. We'll take a minute. |
| 01:24:44.57 | Mary Wagner | Bye. Thank you. Bye. Thank you. |
| 01:24:48.20 | Johnston Malbastad | Thank you. |
| 01:25:01.97 | Mary Wagner | Bye. Thank you. Thank you. |
| 01:25:08.24 | Herb Weiner | Okay. No, no, no, not even for it. Thank you. |
| 01:25:18.35 | Herb Weiner | Okay, all right, we are ready now. We're gonna take up the next item. Thank you. |
| 01:25:23.52 | Bob Licht | Thank you. |
| 01:25:24.48 | Herb Weiner | And that is, Council. |
| 01:25:26.98 | Bob Licht | future. |
| 01:25:31.33 | Herb Weiner | All right, let's get on with city business, please. Council... |
| 01:25:42.47 | Jonathan Leone | you |
| 01:25:45.76 | Jonathan Leone | You can direct the chief to arrest all the rabble-rousers in the hallway. |
| 01:25:48.04 | Herb Weiner | and all the time. Bye. |
| 01:25:50.33 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:25:50.35 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 01:25:50.38 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. |
| 01:25:50.40 | Jonathan Leone | Yeah. |
| 01:25:50.42 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:25:50.97 | Jonathan Leone | Bye. |
| 01:25:51.02 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:25:52.32 | Herb Weiner | All right, Council direction on amending the city smoking regulations. Alison Thornberry, are you here? |
| 01:26:04.07 | Alison Thornberry | Good evening, Mayor Weiner and City Council members. The purpose for this item tonight is to determine if the city would like to to look at amending and updating the city's smoking, the current smoking regulations. Over the last few months, staff has been approached by the Marin County Health and Human Services, and the American Lung Association of California educating staff and encouraging the city to explore new smoke-free air and health protection regulations. The current city's regulations were adopted in 1994 when the city adopted the state of California's regulations. And they have not been updated since. The current regulations state ban smoking in enclosed workplaces within 20 feet of open doors and windows in public buildings. and within state-owned vehicles. As listed in the staff report, Staff has researched the other cities in Marin County and their current smoking regulations. Over the last few years, many cities have updated and amended their existing regulations and started including banning smoking in places such as parks and outdoor dining areas. And some cities have also gone even further and have banned smoking in multi-unit residences and unenclosed common areas. Tonight, staff is recommending that the city council provide direction to staff. on whether the city smoking regulation should be amended and if so what issues Should be addressed in the amendments I'd actually like to pass the microphone over to Bob Curry He's here to give you a presentation and provide additional information. He's from the Marin County Health and Human Services. And also, Pam Granger from the American Lung Association is here to answer any questions or concerns. And staff is available if you have any questions, too. |
| 01:28:15.54 | Bob Curry | Mr. Mayor and council members, thank you for the opportunity to come and give this presentation this evening. Allison's gonna pass to you a little packet, Before I begin, though, I want to say that we get a lot of calls from the public. We're very concerned about different areas where smoke, secondhand smoke, is coming into their areas. In the last few years, we have gotten a tremendous amount of calls that come in in people who are living in multi-unit housing. Secondhand smoke, it goes through the vent systems and into people's homes and unfortunately, their health is at risk when this happens. So we get a lot of calls from people who, you know, there's one woman from Sausalito actually who has been calling us the last few months, may have been in touch with some of you, who has been in a residence for over 20 years. And then somebody moved in next door to her and they're a smoker. She was fine for 20 years, then all of a sudden someone moves in smoking, and all that smoke is constantly coming into her home. And is it right that she would have to move, or should there be some other way to look at it? Before you, and I don't want to start on a sour note, but this is the report card. And Pam is the one who actually puts this together, American Long Association. So I'm just the messenger here. You can get Pam when she comes up. And as you see, Sausalito's grade, unfortunately, right now is an F. And what you see also in the green, if you look at that, are all the areas that people have been working on to upgrade their ordinances. And if you see the green check, that means those communities have looked at those and have adopted them. Larkspur just went through their process, and they've got a B right now. They have not looked at the youth access area, but we actually have a teleconference call with them next week to look at youth access. If they pass that, then they'll have an A. Novato has it on their agenda to look at youth access. They would be bumped up to an A. The Canyonorporated in December are going to be looking at youth access. And the only thing that they haven't done on the secondhand smoke is the multi-unit housing when they adopted those others back about three or four years ago. And so they're going to be hopefully passing that. and they'll be up to an A. So you have an opportunity to move up to an A real quickly, too, if you pass something that's at the end of your packet. Going on to the second sheet, Marin has a fantastic coalition. It's the Smoke Free Marin Coalition. And they have a wonderful website, smokefreemarin.com. which has tremendous amount of information on it. Well, five or six years ago, they were one of the first in the state who started looking at updating ordinances. And they got together with the state attorneys who work on secondhand smoke issues, met with them for about two years, and as a result, the state actually came up with a model ordinance, which takes in most of the things on the first sheet. But we addressed all of these at the coalition, and we're very happy to say that Marin Unincorporated, San Anselmo, Ross, Larkspur, Tiburon, Fairfax, and Novato have really updated a great portion of their ordinances. Most of those that I just named, you can go to their communities and you can enjoy outdoor dining and not worry about somebody lighting up a cigarette after you're halfway through your meal. And we know here in Sausalito especially, it's one of the most beautiful places for you to have your lunch or dinner outside. and to be able to do that without you know, someone coming and lighting up a cigarette is, I think, very important. We also have 20 feet from an entrance. I know the city hall here, there is a city ordinance where you cannot smoke within 20 feet of the entrance. But for all businesses, that has been an issue and one that we get a lot of complaints on. A lot of people will gather right outside the door or window of a business, and they will gather there and they will smoke. And that smoke goes back into the store where people have to walk through that smoke to get into a particular business. Now, we're not saying ban smoking downtown or on all sidewalks. We're only saying that don't stand right next to a door or a window. you can walk as you smoke. If you're going from one location to another, you can smoke on a sidewalk. but don't stand right next to a window or a door. Most of the Hotels and motels that we have in Marin have already, most of them have adopted 100% no smoking. But we decided we should put in the ordinances that it should be at least 85%. Because we look at the number of people who smoke in Marin and it's 10% or less. so it should be only about 10% or so of the rooms that are for smokers in any hotels or motels. Another area where people are standing and waiting for a service of some sort, ATM lines or your bus stops, people are smoking. And so we're asking that people would have to smoke 20 feet away from those folks also. You see here construction and road crews, and you may think that that's unusual, but, you know, if you think about a group of men and women who are working outside, and they're in a closed area, even though it's outside, but it's, you know, four or five feet away from all the other workers and they're constantly smoking all day long. It really isn't fair to the other people that are working in that real confined area to be subjected to the smoke. And so that's why the Smoke Freedman Coalition thought that that was a very important one also to protect our workers. Also farmers markets, public events, parks, and recreational areas. Pam actually gave a presentation to your Parks Commission because they are the ones who were very interested in looking at having parks and recreation areas to be smoke free. And that's especially to protect our young children who use these areas and we don't want to have them around any smoke, secondhand smoke. And then, as I said, the multi-unit housing is something that we're getting a lot of calls in the county, and people are really concerned about this one. And so we have this proposal. The model that we have been proposing, the Smoke-Free Marine Coalition is proposing, is what Larkspur just adopted, and it's what is going before the board of supervisors next month. And that is for any newly constructed multi-unit housing, they'd be 100%. Those would be smoke-free. And any existing would be asked to have 80% of those units that would be smoke-free. And in their parking lots or someplace outside where it's not going to be around a swimming pool or patio areas, that you would have a designated smoking area for those smokers to be able to continue to smoke. And on that note, I just want to say that, you know, this is not against the smokers. We feel, we understand that people have been addicted for years to tobacco. Most smokers don't want to smoke. They're addicted. And there were many reasons. Either that they were young when they started smoking, it was peer pressure, or they were in the service, They started smoking before we knew all the dangers. But whatever it is, there's a lot of people that are addicted. And so we spend a lot of money at the county helping people stop smoking. It's a very, very difficult thing to give up. And so these are not at all against a smoker. It's just about smokers, non-smokers, right to breathing clean air. |
| 01:37:51.84 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 01:37:51.86 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:37:51.91 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 01:37:57.68 | Bob Curry | This other thing, the last little section there is our youth access ordinance. Right now you have a section in your ordinance which fines any retailer who sells to a youth a $100 fine. A lot of retailers are very good and do not sell tobacco to our young people. But last year in Marin County, And the sheriff goes out. We have a contract with the sheriff. The county pays for it. And they do compliance checks, sting operations. Hopefully twice a year as we try and get to all the stores in the county, including Sausalito. Last year, there were 12% of the retailers who actually still are selling to our young people. The idea of a youth access, a retail tobacco licensing, is to have a license where, and because we have the contract, the cost that a lot of communities have objected to is the fee that you would have to put on retailers. Here in Marin County, we really don't have to do that because the county for the last five or six years has been paying for the compliance checks, and that's what really costs the money to have the law enforcement to go out with the youth and to do these compliance checks. So your fee that you would have to put on for retail tobacco licensing would be minimal, maybe $25, $35, something like that. But that gives you the opportunity, once you give them a license, to say if you continue selling to young people, we're going to suspend your license or eventually, if you keep going, we'll just revoke your license. So that's why over 90 cities in the state have already adopted the tobacco retail licensing. And we would, the coalition suggests that you separate the secondhand smoke and the youth access, make two ordinances, and one as a retail licensing and the other as a secondhand smoke and the youth access make two ordinances, and one as a retail licensing, and the other as the secondhand smoke comprehensive ordinance. The next page, I'm not going to go into these. I think we all know that the Surgeon General has come out and said there's just no safe level of secondhand smoke. And that gives you some of that information. I've talked about the outdoor dining. And then the multi-unit housing and the secondhand smoke danger is giving you some question and answers there. The benefits of having a smoke-free multi-unit housing is on the sort of orange color paper right after the green. One of those, if you have a fire, and I don't know if you have any in Sausalito, but they've had a couple up in San Rafael in the last couple of years, it cost a tremendous amount of money when you have apartments on fire because somebody has been smoking. So it's a great safety issue. We also have owners and managers who really, most of them are very supportive of having this because it saves them a tremendous amount of money. If you have a smoker in one of your units and when they leave, it probably costs five, ten times as much to get that ready for the next person to come in and occupy that space. So it's a tremendous savings for them. And when we actually passed the ordinance up in Larkspur, we found that some of the larger complexes decided not just to go with 80% being smoke-free, but they decided they were going to go 100% and just said it makes a lot of sense to do it that way. And lastly, what staff has prepared here for you is what your ordinance would look like if you adopted pretty much everything that is in the current Larkspur and what will be in the county unincorporated. And so this is what, with your numbers here, your numbering system, this is your ordinance. And if you – we did the work so that it would be very easy for you just to say this is great. But whatever you decide to do, I just want to say that we at the county are there to help in whatever way we can help staff put something together. And we also have, as I said, attorneys at the state who are full-time, and they are the experts, and they're there also to help your staff and to help us put something together that would be suitable for Sausalito. And I think, Pam, were you going to? I know she has a great checklist that she wanted to give you, for one thing. |
| 01:43:15.64 | Mary Wagner | you |
| 01:43:26.37 | Pam Granger | Hi, I'm Pam Granger with the American Lung Association. I've been with the organization for about 12 years, and I tell you, it's very interesting to be at the right place at the right time. Back in 2006, people were asking us for smoke-free outdoor dining. They said, we work outside. I don't want to have the job where I have to go out into the patio because that means I have to bend over and help the people and the secondhand smoke is bothering my asthma So there were concerns about entryways and parks, fire damage. I noticed that Sausalito has, I think it's like a styrofoam ban so that you don't pollute the harbor. I don't know if you know that, but you've got one. And so it wouldn't be a big surprise that butts, cigarette butts are the largest single littered item in the world. And if you don't like styrofoam, you gotta not like butts ending up in your bay. So the presentation that I made at John Burns' request as a park commissioner I had me come in, I talked about parks and all the reason why the different communities, that they have gone to smoke-free parks We look at parks as part of a comprehensive checklist. So when communities come to us for technical assistance and making sure that they're doing things that are right and legal and that make good public health sense, they're making parks part of those entryways and part of that outdoor dining and part of those parks. Service lines where people cannot get away And it's all about the smoke. Secondhand smoke, there's no safe level of exposure. People have finally figured out and they're calling and they go, Pam, wait a minute. Secondhand smoke isn't good at work. Why would it be any better at my home? And then we started getting the calls. So when the Surgeon General's report came out in 2006, all of a sudden people still wanted those smoke-free outdoor areas, but now they're worried about where they're living. Their families, the elderly, and the families with young children are the preponderance of people that are living in multi-unit housing. And those are the individuals that don't have the mobility and have the most to lose because they already have growing respiratory systems or compromised respiratory systems. Don't you just wish if we could keep the smoke with a smoker, no problem. I'm all in favor of somebody making their personal choice, as Edward Koop said, the Surgeon General some years back, It's a personal choice whether or not you want to smoke, knowing everything that we do. It perhaps is not a wise choice, but the minute that it becomes into somebody else's breathing space. Now it's a public health issue. It's all about breathing clean and healthy air That's the calls that I get. That's the calls that Bob and his crew get. It's about people who say, I want to breathe clean and healthy air. Please, just because I have to live in an apartment, And some people say, I'd love to live in my apartment. I can only afford to live in my apartment I shouldn't have worse air quality than somebody who can afford a single family home. It's all about social justice, and we have to make sure that everybody and Sausalito has a chance to breathe. clean and healthy air, and you can help. So we're here to support any questions. I've worked in the Bay Area. There's a Virtually every ordinance that's passed in the Bay Area, of which I have just one copy of this, these are all the communities in the state that have passed multi-unit housing policies of some kind or other. And if they were in the Bay Area, the Lung Association has been part of that. We can tell you about education, we can tell you about enforcement, So we're here. You decide you have questions, whatever we can do, a little bit, a lot. We recommend a lot. But think of clean and healthy air for everybody. Thank you. |
| 01:47:33.86 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Are there any questions up here? |
| 01:47:38.94 | Mike Kelly | If you pass the ordinance on the multifamily housing and you make it 100%, say, who enforces that? |
| 01:47:50.92 | Bob Curry | A lot of the laws that we have, number one, and we have this from the history over the last 20 years, are self-enforcing, especially here in Marin County. We have gotten awards actually from the state American Lung Association for high compliance. We had over 95 percent compliance when they passed the original bars and restaurant, no smoking. So usually with good education and signage, people usually will comply. Given that, if they don't, we at the county can work with staff to write something up like we did in a couple of the other counties where we can get the first call or handle the first complaint that comes in by sending out a letter or making a phone call to a manager or a store or whatever and tell them that this is the law, this is what you have to do to make sure you have good signage, make sure people aren't, you know, out on your outdoor dining patio or whatever smoking. And just usually that does the trick. Usually just one call or one letter saying that they have to make sure they remove ashtrays and just get in compliance is enough. Given that, after that, and we have very, very few calls that ever go to the next step of having a visit from law enforcement, but very, very little that we have experienced with the other communities who have adopted any of these policies so far. |
| 01:48:15.84 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 01:48:15.96 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:48:15.98 | Bob Dar | you |
| 01:48:16.06 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:48:16.13 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 01:49:21.52 | Bob Dar | you know, |
| 01:49:26.28 | Bob Dar | THE END OF |
| 01:49:32.78 | Pam Granger | And if I could speak to that as well, In housing, what we discovered, well, it wasn't a big surprise, is that the owners and managers already have a set of operating conditions for their lease agreements. And so not smoking in a unit becomes part of a lease agreement. And just like loud noise in pets, it's a complaint for violation of the lease. So it doesn't mean that individuals who smoke can't have housing. It simply means they can't smoke in that housing in a way that it would disturb their neighbors. So the rules and regulations that they have there are in place. Is it sloppy at the beginning? All of this is sloppy at the beginning. If you think back to smoke-free workplaces, that was a little a little messy. But it doesn't take long for people to catch on. And part of our responsibility is to support you and to do that public education. In fact, we're doing a public education piece Monday from Marin unincorporated. So we're here to back you on that, but it's not an unusual phenomenon. The two things people are always concerned about are rights and enforcement. And there's no legal right to smoke. I know that sounds awful to say it that way, but it's a consumer group. you know, so like Pepsi, but you don't have you know, secondhand Pepsi, I guess. So, you know, that's one kind of concern and the other is about enforcement. And if you call your neighbors, call Novato and ask them how many complaints they've had at the city because I have. |
| 01:51:02.99 | Bob Dar | And if you call your name, |
| 01:51:07.92 | Pam Granger | They aren't getting complaints. What if you had three complaints and they were in 2007? Yeah. But it's a good question. It comes up every time for good reasons. |
| 01:51:18.94 | Bob Curry | And the other thing here that I just am passing out, we had thousands of these made up at A lot of the other communities have posted these in their windows and I think people see these and they certainly get used to seeing these and understand that there is no smoking once they...we like the fact that we can have these in all of our communities and that's why we made up thousands and we've got plenty for you. |
| 01:51:27.22 | Bob Dar | COMMUNITY. |
| 01:51:45.99 | Bob Curry | Thank you. |
| 01:51:46.32 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:51:46.36 | Bob Curry | Thank you. |
| 01:51:46.41 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. Amen. |
| 01:51:48.62 | Herb Weiner | Yeah, I have a quick question. On your last compliance sweep of selling to miners, were any Sausalito businesses in that. Thank you. |
| 01:52:00.40 | Bob Curry | And I knew you'd be asking that, but which is great. It's a tremendous thing that currently last year there were none of the businesses in Sausalito, which then makes it even easier if we've got people who comply with the |
| 01:52:03.84 | Herb Weiner | Yeah. |
| 01:52:19.47 | Bob Curry | But it's still important to have the law for any who decide that they're not going to. We actually had, which is hard to imagine, but four of the pharmacies in Marin County sold to our young people last year. Four of our pharmacies. So if we thought we had this as a no problem at all to have four pharmacies in one year cell was really something that made us a little upset. |
| 01:52:51.14 | Pam Granger | Part of the reason too for having a license is because state law has a fine. It's against the law to sell to minors. The trouble is you could be fined and fined and it's a very profitable business. And one thing about a license is it puts in a provision that repetitive selling to miners can remove your right to sell the product. That becomes a deterrent. fine is not a deterrent. We hear stories of people being reimbursed by the tobacco industry as a cost of doing business. For products sold, and stolen. Oh, a little inventory loss? No problem. We'll take care of that for you. It's part of the logic too that wasn't mentioned. |
| 01:53:31.51 | Mary Wagner | Okay. Go ahead. |
| 01:53:33.18 | Carolyn Ford | A couple of questions. If we decide to go with a no smoking program that includes all of these things, you can provide us this sort of thing at what cost? |
| 01:53:36.03 | Mary Wagner | We do. |
| 01:53:48.67 | Bob Curry | There's no cost for that signage there. We've already purchased them, and so we've got thousands. The other is the cessation for people, helping people to stop smoking. That is something that we provide at no charge. We've got two or three people, actually, at Bay Area Community Resources that we contract with, and they run cessation classes throughout the county all year long. And if we have, say, an apartment complex who had four or five people who want to actually go to cessation, if we've got four or five people, we'll come down and give them that cessation class. It's a six week program and we'll provide that on site for them. But we provide the cessation services at the county. |
| 01:54:35.38 | Carolyn Ford | Okay. |
| 01:54:39.26 | Carolyn Ford | Okay. And are there other expenses for cities when they do this, you know, other than just the ordinance which you have given us? Thank you very much. |
| 01:54:48.09 | Pam Granger | Certainly, there is a cost for signs. I'll use Petaluma as an example. Petaluma redid their parks ordinance. and they were in the process of changing their signs. So as they did it on a rolling basis because that was how they replaced their signs. So to start putting up, and it's real important, signage is part of that self-enforcing thing. And so, yes, your public works would have to tell you |
| 01:55:12.62 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 01:55:17.16 | Pam Granger | Where they would start with signs, you know, they would start a few, and some of the beginning ones can be those laminated paper ones while they wait to get the metal ones to go around that have a more permanence. |
| 01:55:29.06 | Bob Dar | go around. |
| 01:55:31.23 | Pam Granger | So that's the... |
| 01:55:31.74 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 01:55:33.75 | Pam Granger | The one thing that I can think of is park and rec for signage. |
| 01:55:35.72 | Carolyn Ford | is. is a All right, great. And my second question relates to housing, multi-unit housing. I noticed in a couple of the examples in our packet, that cities had insisted that new multi-unit housing be non-smoking and that some of them had said that current existing housing be non-smoking by the year, say, 2014. Any experience in which works best to, okay. |
| 01:56:11.30 | Pam Granger | I'm not sure. Right, and another good question, early on, cities were, and this has been really dynamic, the one copy that I passed on, or did I give it to you yet, it shows the, the, the, the the rolling through starting in 2007, so you get the lessons learned. And first it said, okay, well, let's see, we enact our ordinances in 30 days, and so we'll go with that. which works very well for common areas, and it works very well for outside doorways to have it be whatever your normal inaction time is. But when it got to the units, The practical matter was is it took a while for the word to get out to the tenants. So cities began to look at about a 12-month period to a 14-month period so they could make sure that the leases were turning over, that each time somebody renewed a lease or went month to month at the end of the first year, They could have a new lease in place, and it became a practical issue. And don't get me wrong, the individuals who left next door where the smoke was coming through because now Aunt Sally has come to visit and she smokes like a chimney, those people were not excited about waiting 12 months. And the property owner tomorrow could make their property smoke-free. I mean, they have that legal right to do it. And so they don't have to wait that length of time. That's how it sort of distilled down to that 12 to 14 month period of time. It was just practical purposes. |
| 01:57:46.00 | Carolyn Ford | Okay, and I can understand that a person who owns an apartment complex could do this without an issue, but what about condominiums? What sorts of problems have you had there? The |
| 01:57:57.52 | Pam Granger | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 01:57:57.93 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 01:57:57.96 | Pam Granger | Thank you. Did you have the... In condos, it's the same issue. The, you think, oh, well there's a concern about Ownership, and that's the same flip that over. The person who says, I own this condo. I can't move anywhere. |
| 01:58:07.63 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 01:58:07.78 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 01:58:07.90 | Bob Dar | That's right. |
| 01:58:14.65 | Pam Granger | it's a down market, where am I gonna take my family and go to? The property has the right layout which most of them do, a designated smoking area can be put into place. But those that are living in apartments, but legally there's not an issue, but it's helpful to have, to go through steps to notify people and to advise them. I mean, it can be done. And those are the people that are saying, don't leave us out. because that was a temptation early. We'll just do apartments and we won't do townhouses and condos. And those people are kind of screaming right now in Alhambra. They're lined up like this line, this wonderful line that was just here for your the sailing group, They're all lined up and they're saying, What, we don't get clean and healthy air? |
| 01:59:07.23 | Bob Dar | THE FAMILY. |
| 01:59:09.56 | Pam Granger | You know, they're asking the same thing. So, you know, that's always a, when you get into property ownership, you'd like people to be able to do a thing as long as it wasn't beating their kids. you know, what they wanted. It's the trouble is, is it doesn't stay with them. And those apartment owners and condo owners are saying, treat us equally. you |
| 01:59:28.99 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 01:59:29.00 | Pam Granger | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 01:59:30.22 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 01:59:32.33 | Jonathan Leone | How do you, and I'm in no way supportive of smoking, but some folks in some studies seem to indicate that it's somewhat more prevalent among certain demographics than others. |
| 01:59:46.65 | Bob Dar | Sure. |
| 01:59:48.83 | Jonathan Leone | The complaint sometimes is that it is somewhat of a, in an economic sense, it would be a regressive kind of concept that ethnic groups and those less fortunate economically are the ones more penalized in some way or the ones more affected by these regulations than others. What's the argument against that, and is that true or is it not true? |
| 02:00:13.77 | Pam Granger | Well, you're exactly right, Councilman, is it Leoni? Leon. |
| 02:00:17.45 | Jonathan Leone | owns. |
| 02:00:17.99 | Jerry Fate | Yeah. |
| 02:00:18.84 | Pam Granger | You're exactly right that that is a hypothesis that goes out there because it's true that there's a higher smoking prevalence among individuals with lower socioeconomic status and with lower education. So a lot of the individuals with means and with higher education have made a conscious choice not to smoke. And that's just the same group that the tobacco industries prey upon. how sad that the disproportionate amount of cost goes to those individuals. However, it becomes a real social justice issue when you look, if anybody was to suggest that because you didn't have money or because your education was low that you were entitled to less air quality. And therein lies that it's really our responsibility to protect the poor and less well educated to the same extent that we do others. It's our right. They may not have the the physical, they may not have the medical Treatment. that to people who are better off do. And so they may not take their kids to the doctor to get their prevention medicine. Those are the individuals who are stuck. They don't have a voice. I think we have to be a voice for them to give them that same clean and healthy air. |
| 02:01:45.27 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Okay, at this time here any questions from the public on this item? |
| 02:01:57.62 | Vicki Nichols | Vicki Nichols, as we all know, our downtown community is host to a lot of European visitors around the world visitors. How can we enforce this without being totally unfriendly or how would this even, how would this look? I don't want us to be perceived as hall monitors for our tourists. |
| 02:02:19.88 | Pam Granger | And that's a very good question, too, because we are a, the whole Bay Area is a magnet. It makes all the top 10 lists of places to visit. And right across the bridge, you know, here is lovely Sausalito. What's interesting to find is that if you look at your neighboring communities, these are the kind of policies that they're passing. This is the kind of policy that they're passing in San Francisco. This is the kind of policy that world travelers are beginning to understand. surprised you may be to know that there's no smoking, supposedly, in pubs in Ireland, that the famous sidewalk cafes of France, no smoking on the sidewalk cafes. So this is the world community and in many instances is well ahead of us. Certainly courtesy is paramount. That's where the signage we talk about, so there's that sort of international with the cigarette and the sign through it. That helps people because if they're not embarrassed, they look. I haven't done a lot of foreign travel, but I'll look around and see if I can pick up the social norm. of something that's going along there, so that, because I don't want to be embarrassed either, And I think that probably, especially in your downtown area, everybody's used to being a really good ambassador. And so I think that it's pretty easy to say, oh, even I'm so sorry if it were just up to me, you could smoke here, but you can see that It just isn't allowed, but you could go No, no, or you could, there's a designated post there. Or, and thank you so much for coming, let me show you the sale items. So I think, you know, I think that it's not as unusual as you might think, and it's not like you can run to a lot of different places if you take a look at, Tiburon and Fairfax and Larkspur are all pretty darn close, and they have the same kind of a thing. And so you'll be joining the group as opposed to being the only punitive ones. But that's an excellent question because we all need all the commerce we can get. |
| 02:04:34.27 | Herb Weiner | Okay, any other questions from the public? |
| 02:04:46.73 | John Fasanis | I don't agree with the two myths that you put forward about the world community being ahead of us. actually smoking Um, Let's say There is one, One thing I may say, and the best people travel, the best people from Europe. are smokers. That's part of, they're behind us. And, and, um, and smoking the Hollywood thing, there's still They're still 10 or 15 years behind us. I don't agree with that. And also putting on the lower socioeconomic demographic group, I take offense at that, and the ethnicities because in front of all these bars. I'm a designated driver. I started a taxi cab company to bring an accessible cab to West Marin and to keep drunks off our roadways. I was motivated on the basis of the fact that I myself Um, I am a disabled individual. when I needed transport Um, because of a coma induced by misdiagnosed medication given me by a doctor I was medevaced I, um... a helicopter from West Marin and it cost 9,000 bucks. And also, I had another coma a week later. And I was... by an ambulance that cost $2,500. I try to explore A remedy. for that. And I thought, well, an accessible taxi in West Marin. would be an answer for that. And I went to... of. I'm not. the Marin County Supervisors Board, and they said, well, West Marin doesn't I have a... the density that would justify us spending taxpayers' dollars on an accessible taxi. But we will give you A taxi license. so that you can fulfill your agenda. and come back to us. three or four years' time. and show us your track record so we can award you an accessible catalog. the last four years. West Virginia's lost 25% of its population. Um, So I have less of a, less of a justification for an accessible taxi. than I did four years ago. Um, at least. from the county and from the county taxpayers. But. What I've learned, doing designated driving of drunks at 2 a.m. in the morning. and sitting outside the bars is that... The people are smoking. since Renn County, Most of the, is that my three minutes? Most of my... Most of my time spending for clients is outside the bars. And, uh, and I respond also to calls, but the people that are smoking are white, and they're usually ensconced. They're usually from, if I'm at the Silver Paisville and they're from Kent Woodlands and from Greenbrae and from Kenfield and from Larkspur and from Corte Madera. if I'm out Smitty's, with a no-name, either from Sausalito and the surrounding the surrounding area. If I'm at the 2AM club, they're from Mill Valley or Tiburon. |
| 02:08:35.13 | Herb Weiner | Yeah, try to finish it up. You're on your own. Can't, please. |
| 02:08:36.51 | John Fasanis | Good job. What I've found, since I have my boots on the ground, I'm the boots on the ground person in here. Um, What I found is that the peer pressure from all these congested the congestion outside the bars where all these people are smoking. And I disagree with the gentlemen's I'm not sure. theory that that having the people stand Give me an aisle way. So the smoke doesn't travel inside the bars is an effective Roos to... Um, to provide clean air inside the bars I think that that smoking outside bars should be eliminated because of the fact is that what it does basically, it creates acolytes of smoking. Because what do people do? They try to leave the barn to get a little bit of fresh air. Everybody's smoking, so what do they do? They join in. And everybody asks, can you, I watch these people, I say, I see these people ask, do you have an extra cigarette? Do you have an extra cigarette? And during the daytime hours, I see the kids come by and say, do you have an extra cigarette? I was just curious about the loss about an individual giving a cigarette to a person that's underage. Um, Because if they can't buy them from stores, then they just go around and bum them off other people that's up. professional smokers or older people and they don't seem to have an aversion to giving a child, a cigarette, because it seems like misery like some company? |
| 02:10:12.90 | Herb Weiner | I got to cut you off on your time. |
| 02:10:14.47 | John Fasanis | on your time. Misery loves the company. Thank you. |
| 02:10:20.87 | Herb Weiner | Okay, any other questions from the public? Okay, let's bring it back up here. |
| 02:10:27.08 | Jonathan Leone | Just to clarify, my point is there are studies that, it's not to offend anyone, but there are studies about the demographics of smoking, and the point was to have people respond to the argument that you shouldn't implement these programs because they disadvantage some versus others. |
| 02:10:43.09 | Herb Weiner | other. Okay. All right. What do we have on this? |
| 02:10:52.83 | Jonathan Leone | Yeah, so I'll make a motion to direct staff to review the documents. And I think the Adam or Mary or Debbie, I think the Sustainability Commission didn't they have this on one of their things? I can't remember. But I would direct staff to send this back to you, the sustainability or the legislative committee. |
| 02:11:17.84 | Adam Politzer | Yeah, it may be best to take it back to Parks and Rec, but the Sustainability Commission... Well, it touches so many other things....but as you remember, the Chairperson Ray Gurgis had said, it really hasn't fallen on our... |
| 02:11:21.97 | Jonathan Leone | Okay. Sustainability commission. Well, it touches so many other things. |
| 02:11:30.60 | Jonathan Leone | Oh, that's right. |
| 02:11:30.61 | Adam Politzer | Oh, that's right. OK. But we thought that it was important for the city Thank you. the, The direction can come from the Council for Staff. to bring something back to you based on our recommendations working with these fine folks that are helping other cities. Um, and or take it to the Parks and Recreation Commission to have them work with staff and then bring the recommendation back to the council. |
| 02:11:55.44 | Jonathan Leone | know with that um so uh maybe it's best to have the staff focus on it and but i would ask that you know even though i think i'll just go back and look at the ranking this didn't make the top 50 or 25 projects that we tried to do um as folks didn't rank it as highly as some and but we need to start swapping things off that list if we need to do to take raise this up |
| 02:12:21.66 | Adam Politzer | Yeah, can I comment on that? And I think that's why you have our presenters here that have offered to do the majority, if not all, of the work. Okay. And that's part of the, you know, that's part of our response to the community. If it's not on the list, then you've got to do the heavy lifting. And you saw that with Heather Richards earlier. Right. Did all the work, brought it forward, and got support. And I think that's what the county and the Lend Association is willing to do. |
| 02:12:31.09 | Jonathan Leone | Okay. |
| 02:12:40.98 | Jonathan Leone | Right. |
| 02:12:48.03 | Jonathan Leone | That's great because that's very helpful, and thank you for doing a lot of the heavy lifting for us. So I'll make a motion to have staff. I would think it would be worth having it go through one round before it comes here at some level, and I'll leave that up to you what the right forum for that is and come back when that meeting. |
| 02:12:51.81 | Adam Politzer | Thank you. |
| 02:13:10.97 | Jonathan Leone | has been reviewed and sort of tweaked to whatever local standards are appropriate or whether it's, you know, hotel percentages or whatever the right tweaks need to be put in place to accommodate adopting it somewhat to Sausalito. Thank you. |
| 02:13:27.34 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:13:27.37 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. Second. Adapting it somewhat precisely. Okay. Mr. Mayor. |
| 02:13:28.79 | Carolyn Ford | Um... Thank you. |
| 02:13:32.30 | Herb Weiner | Here we have. |
| 02:13:32.82 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 02:13:32.96 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 02:13:33.18 | Carolyn Ford | Yes. I would like to amend that motion to be a little more specific and have it, indeed, have it go back through Parks and Rec one more time once you have worked with the people here. Have it go back through them as part of a broader representation of the community. |
| 02:13:57.93 | Jonathan Leone | I would, in some cases, I would agree that so many of these issues are outside of anything that they deal with. There's only a small portion of this deals with the parks. So I think that given that we already have a model ordinance, it would probably be the best of staff to work with these fine folks and iron out kind of some of the issues or take it some other route rather than to park and rec. I just don't think it belongs there. |
| 02:14:26.64 | Carolyn Ford | Well, I wouldn't discount working with the people here. It's the mayor, sorry. But I do think that Parks and Rec took a big interest in this in the beginning. And I would like to at least see their input on the parks, if nothing else. and of major events. |
| 02:14:44.25 | Herb Weiner | AND IT'S A VERY All right, so we have an amended motion that we... No, we haven't had a second on that. I second. |
| 02:14:54.70 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. |
| 02:14:54.75 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 02:14:54.78 | Linda Pfeifer | I see. |
| 02:14:55.04 | Carolyn Ford | Second. |
| 02:14:55.61 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. |
| 02:14:56.06 | Jonathan Leone | um, on that. |
| 02:14:58.09 | Linda Pfeifer | Kelsey McCullough-Lan's motion is there. I believe that was |
| 02:15:02.60 | Herb Weiner | No, no, Mike, I'll be checking it. |
| 02:15:04.33 | Linda Pfeifer | I seconded his motion. Yes. So that's a substitute. |
| 02:15:05.72 | Herb Weiner | Yes. |
| 02:15:07.05 | Mike Kelly | So the voting is going to amend this motion. |
| 02:15:07.12 | Linda Pfeifer | Yes. |
| 02:15:07.62 | Herb Weiner | Right. That's right. |
| 02:15:09.92 | Linda Pfeifer | That's right. |
| 02:15:10.12 | Mike Kelly | Right. |
| 02:15:10.53 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 02:15:11.12 | Carolyn Ford | you |
| 02:15:11.40 | Linda Pfeifer | you |
| 02:15:12.74 | Carolyn Ford | Okay. |
| 02:15:13.36 | Mike Kelly | Send it. |
| 02:15:14.56 | Carolyn Ford | Yeah, to have staff, let me just clarify what the amended or what the substitute motion is, and that's to have staff work with the people here tonight who have given us a new ordinance and then also send it through Parks and Rec one more time to get public input at two different levels. I would just like to see that kind of input before, and anyone else you think it should go through before we bring it back to council. So the public is well aware of what's going on. |
| 02:15:47.53 | Jonathan Leone | Right, which was my original motion, which was to leave it to the staff to send it to the right avenues that they saw fit. |
| 02:15:49.59 | Mike Kelly | Bye. Thank you. |
| 02:15:52.24 | Carolyn Ford | the right. |
| 02:15:52.61 | Mike Kelly | Thank you. |
| 02:15:54.71 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 02:15:54.72 | Mary Wagner | Just to follow up. |
| 02:15:54.89 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 02:15:54.91 | Mike Kelly | Just to follow Rosenberg's rules, three basic motions, the basic motion, the motion to amend, which is what I heard, and then now we've suddenly invented a substitute motion. So I think they have- |
| 02:16:02.67 | Linda Pfeifer | We'll be right back. No, I apologize if I put the wrong term through it. |
| 02:16:07.89 | Mike Kelly | Yeah, I think we need to... I heard a motion to amend. Is that not what I heard? Yes. Yeah, well, we... |
| 02:16:09.25 | Linda Pfeifer | I heard it. |
| 02:16:12.31 | Carolyn Ford | Yeah, well, we don't have, excuse me, if I may. I did not make it a motion to amend. I made a substitute motion based on our city attorney's recommendation. |
| 02:16:15.56 | Linda Pfeifer | THE END OF THE END OF THE |
| 02:16:15.63 | Vicki Nichols | I know. |
| 02:16:15.83 | Linda Pfeifer | It is. |
| 02:16:15.90 | Vicki Nichols | Thank you. |
| 02:16:15.97 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. |
| 02:16:23.97 | Linda Pfeifer | If I may have a moment. Yes. And I will actually read from the rules what the title of the appropriate motion has to be. |
| 02:16:25.16 | Carolyn Ford | Yes. |
| 02:16:40.89 | Linda Pfeifer | I sit corrected. There is the basic motion and there was a second to that motion. And then there is a motion to amend which is to change the basic motion. And that was made by Council Member Ford. So mine is amend not substitute. Thank you. I apologize for creating any confusion. |
| 02:16:57.50 | Carolyn Ford | Yes, thank you. I apologize for creating. |
| 02:17:03.17 | Herb Weiner | So was there a second on that amended? Yes, Linda. |
| 02:17:06.54 | Linda Pfeifer | Yes. |
| 02:17:06.97 | Carolyn Ford | Yes. |
| 02:17:08.01 | Herb Weiner | So we'll vote on the second. |
| 02:17:08.36 | Mike Kelly | to vote. |
| 02:17:09.34 | Adam Politzer | Thank you. |
| 02:17:09.50 | Jack Myshock | Thank you. |
| 02:17:12.60 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yes. |
| 02:17:15.79 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. Thank you. All right. |
| 02:17:16.99 | Adam Politzer | after hearing the discussion, and understanding what Councilmember Leon was suggesting I think that it maybe worth giving staff a little bit of an opportunity to consider all the options. We have a lot of different groups that probably would be interested in this discussion and I think with the help of the county and the Lung Association, we may want to take this show a little bit on the road. going through this in the city of Belmont. where I worked in 2007. uh, I recognize the importance of the community involvement and so the Chamber of Commerce, the VAC, The legislative committee is another place where it might make some sense to, as we've done with construction time limit ordinances and other items of sensitive nature or community. Thank you. Interest. I'm not a smoker. I just have a cold. Thank you. but I think I think allowing staff that you know this is something that we've brought forward tonight to get some direction I think we've heard the direction obviously the Park and Rec Commission was interested they will play a role in in this they may it may not need to go back to them in sense that they might have made their recommendations of what they would like to see happen but if there's some opportunity for additional public outreach and comment through the Parks and Recreation Commission, let staff take a crack at that and then eventually bring it back to council for direction. But I don't think there needs to be much debate on. what process it goes through, I think, that will exercise good judgment and try to cover as many groups as we can to inform the community. I think the information that was provided tonight was really valuable and important And, unlike Belmont that was kind of out in front, you know, we're now getting to be where everyone else is and that's a good position to be especially on this particular item but it's also where I think we ought to be at the end of the day. |
| 02:19:12.65 | John Fasanis | here. |
| 02:19:12.97 | Bob Dar | THE FAMILY. |
| 02:19:21.97 | Adam Politzer | We won't drag this out, that's for certain. We'll expedite this. but to give us that flexibility based on the holidays and the calendar to get it in front of as many groups as we can and then back to you, you know, near the beginning of the year might make a lot of sense. |
| 02:19:38.03 | Mary Wagner | Good. |
| 02:19:38.30 | Herb Weiner | it. So we have the amendment? |
| 02:19:43.34 | Carolyn Ford | So moved. I move that we do what the city council, what our city manager is suggesting. |
| 02:19:43.58 | Adam Politzer | Bye. |
| 02:19:49.59 | Adam Politzer | And I think I'm just asking that you drop your amendment, leave the motion that Councilmember Leon made to leave it to the discretion of staff to take it to whatever committee makes sense or group that makes sense and then come back to the council for action. |
| 02:19:59.55 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:19:59.56 | Carolyn Ford | Sure. |
| 02:20:07.04 | Carolyn Ford | I agree. Thank you. |
| 02:20:07.85 | Adam Politzer | Thank you. |
| 02:20:08.22 | Herb Weiner | you Thank you. |
| 02:20:08.45 | Adam Politzer | Okay. |
| 02:20:09.05 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 02:20:09.67 | Adam Politzer | So. |
| 02:20:09.97 | Herb Weiner | we'll go back to the |
| 02:20:13.10 | Adam Politzer | So you have a first and second. Thank you. |
| 02:20:14.61 | Herb Weiner | Okay. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Okay. Thank you. Okay. Next item is the direct staff to initiate action to amend Section 10-54050, Design Review of Public Projects to Exempt Guard Rail Projects from Design Review. Todd Teachum. |
| 02:20:16.28 | Adam Politzer | Aye. |
| 02:21:34.74 | Jonathon Goldman | It's there somewhere. |
| 02:21:40.27 | Jonathon Goldman | Guardrail. |
| 02:21:46.48 | Unknown | Whoa, whoa, we scrolled past G's. Is it in a folder? is, is, Thank you. Thank you. Bye. of the Thank you. |
| 02:22:01.97 | Mike Kelly | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 02:22:02.11 | Unknown | Exactly. Wait, go in the 11. Open that one. Open the 11th one. |
| 02:22:11.81 | Mike Kelly | Open last week. |
| 02:22:14.63 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. |
| 02:22:17.77 | Bob Licht | Thank you. Uh... |
| 02:22:18.83 | Jonathon Goldman | I've got two options. You can give me a couple minutes and I can move it over there, or I can just do it without. |
| 02:22:18.86 | Bob Licht | to ask |
| 02:22:25.63 | Adam Politzer | Thank you. |
| 02:22:25.67 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 02:22:25.68 | Adam Politzer | Okay, yeah, we'll get... |
| 02:22:27.10 | Herb Weiner | We're going to take up to a five-minute break. Okay. Or less. |
| 02:22:31.10 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. Bye. I'll be back. Moved it to the right place and thank you for the time to do that. Okay. The title in your staff report is to the point, but it's really a broader discussion that I wanted to have. We have a capital project in the budget, a capital improvement project to install a guardrail at Glen Drive. And the council and the planning commission have struggled with some capital project approvals recently. that suggests to me that before these projects, the Glen Street guardrail and a couple other requests that we've had move forward, they kind of have a reality check on the topic. And the topic is, are some capital projects, do some capital projects need the design review process? So with that, I think we all know what a guardrail is, but it's a safety device to keep motor vehicles generally within the roadway. And there are typically two standard types of guardrails, even though your report has quite a few more. There are two basic ones approved in the state of California. And these are the most common ones. On the left is the steel W or three beam barrier. And on the right is typically called the K rail. Its official designation is the Type 60 concrete barrier. I think both of the concrete one in particular is not very appealing from an SSX standpoint, but it's very effective in keeping vehicles within the roadway. California is starting to recognize that, so They've been experimenting with making concrete ones a little more appealing. And I provide a report in your staff report that has them kind of do a snapshot on Thank you. what has been done with regard to that type of material. because there are only two standard types, there's not really a lot of options available. They have to go through extensive crash testing with a wide variety of motor vehicles. There's... fairly limited choices uh, There are nonstandard guardrails, but the lack of extensive testing, structural design verification is necessary to make them applicable. There's a whole infrastructure involved with putting these devices on the roadway. It's not all aesthetic, and it's not all safety. There's a very extensive vetting process that involves the motor vehicle manufacturers, involves insurance companies, involves a lot of different bodies. Very few elements can be altered, and none of them really affect the aesthetics. Mostly they have to deal with the end treatments. If you alter the faces very much, and there's been some testing on it, they can be rendered quite ineffective very quickly. So typically the modifiable elements of a guardrail are the length and the end treatments. You either bury them or there's two or three types that can safely catch and respond to an impact. |
| 02:26:48.63 | Jonathon Goldman | Guardrails are currently in our capital project budget, and we have section 10.54.050 of the municipal code that says that requires capital projects with appreciable changes in appearance of an area to undergo design review. So the question is, do guardrails appreciably change the appearance of an area? Does appearance concerns outweigh safety concerns? Do safety concerns outweigh appearance concerns? Those really are the basic questions. I hope to get some feedback from you all today. This is a very recent incident, and this is primarily why this matters before you right now. This happened no more than four weeks ago at the intersection of Curtin. |
| 02:27:42.95 | Jonathon Goldman | at the intersection |
| 02:27:43.73 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 02:27:43.74 | Jonathon Goldman | It was not. |
| 02:27:43.81 | Herb Weiner | It was not a pizza delivery, I'll tell you that. |
| 02:27:47.64 | Jonathon Goldman | At the intersection of Curry and Montemar, a This car was unable to stop, crashed through. uh, a bamboo landscape screen. There had been placed some bollards along this area in the past, but this car found the gap between the bollards and came right through. Uh, we got inquiry about installing a bollard instead of a guardrail and, um, We're struggling with responding to that. Bollard is easily installed, but it tends to catch cars and not necessarily keep them in the roadway. a guardrail will won't catch a car, it will generally keep it, it will deflect it back into the roadway. So as a result of this accident, we've had a request to install a guardrail at this site. we're contemplating how to deal with that, possibly coming back to you depending on the outcome of the... that I had before you and maybe changing some of the priorities or maybe adding some additional budget. We have four sites in town where we've had guardrail requests. within the last five years. Rodeo Uh. That came in after a truck was coming off the freeway too fast and rolled over. Monte Barr also right off the freeway. There's a little shoulder area. that is... a very attractive parking place. And the reason for the quest there isn't so much as a car rolling down more fear that there might be a slide and the car might just get caught in a slide and slide down into the homes. |
| 02:29:55.49 | Jonathon Goldman | Oops. Glenn Drive here is the project that we have a 65% plan developed and then Curry is where that van photograph was taken. Curry is straightforward. It's a wood barricade. It's rotted and it's broken off. A barrier is not a guardrail, and there's a fairly large grade differential between the two segments of this street, and a guardrail would be keep cars up on the high side. This is the street side of where the van came. This was taken just a few hours ago. They put a board where the van went through, and the van took out. The bamboo hasn't grown back yet. This is a close up and this is from across the intersection, the stop bar at Monte Mar and Currie. |
| 02:31:07.90 | Jonathon Goldman | This is the Montemar right off the freeway. This picture shows the grade break between the road and the abutting properties and common driveway. There's a fairly steep drop off there. And this is Rodeo. All four situations, there's a fairly severe grade break. And there's opportunities for cars to, if a car went off the roadway path, it's not contained. |
| 02:31:24.49 | Bob Dar | Uh, |
| 02:31:39.92 | Jonathon Goldman | So there's a question now, how do we go about installing them? A guardrail can be a fairly simple project, but Thank you. about seven years ago, Under a similar situation, we got a request to install guard rail. on Spencer Avenue. just above where Sausalito Boulevard intersects. It's the backside of 33 Miller, and I wanna say 100 Spencer. and The previous staff developed a project, got it, I don't know if it was put in by maintenance staff or contract forces, but it was put up. and As soon as it was put up, there was a fairly strong reaction. It was one of those metal guard rail types that was installed. And as a result, it was taken down. I wanted to have this discussion first, get some feedback from you. There's a lot of options on the capital side, but I think more fundamentally we've got this issue of whether or not the appropriateness of a safety facility going through a design review process. So there's these five options that I thought of. There are probably a few more, the ones that I'm asking that you a motion for is to authorize that during the omnibus review of the zoning ordinance that's going on right now, that this discussion be embedded so that it can be widely vetted in a pretty broad forum. The risk about that is I don't know what the timetable is for that. It could be a few months. It could be a few years before that gets done. In the meantime, we've got projects that... have been waiting, probably could go through the design review process, and we could kind of experiment on that side how the community would react. you could, either for the four sites that we've shown or just in general, |
| 02:34:11.26 | Bob Licht | Thank you. |
| 02:34:11.33 | Mary Wagner | you |
| 02:34:11.38 | Bob Licht | you |
| 02:34:18.79 | Jonathon Goldman | direct us to prepare a resolution saying that these are safety facilities and safety takes precedent over aesthetics and just to authorize a resolution occurred to exempt these facilities from the design review process. |
| 02:34:23.87 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:34:39.42 | Jonathon Goldman | You could direct us to do one to four of the sites, exempt those particular sites narrowly to advance them, You could ask us to develop a standard guardrail. That one would be a little risky because outside of a minor aesthetic treatment to maybe the concrete ones, we would have to spend a fortune to get it approved through the crash worthiness process. I don't think we have the resources to do that. Or we could do nothing, and doing nothing means that that as projects get advanced, at some point they would go through a planning review process and may or may not get approved and may or may not be developed. So. Todd, I told you I |
| 02:35:39.99 | Jonathan Leone | Todd, I told you I'd take the 79 tourists that they're going to, you know, go to auction and I'll crash into anything you want me to. Thank you. |
| 02:35:41.83 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. |
| 02:35:51.40 | Jonathon Goldman | So we think the most prudent route is to allow this item to be discussed in the omnibus zoning review process. So with that, I'll entertain any questions. Thank you. |
| 02:35:51.46 | Jonathan Leone | Sorry. |
| 02:36:08.36 | Carolyn Ford | Mr. Mayor? Yes. I have a couple questions, Todd. These guardrails that you're showing, the steel one and then the concrete, are for freeways, right? |
| 02:36:09.22 | Jonathon Goldman | Yes. |
| 02:36:20.88 | Jonathon Goldman | I mean, is there – They're for all California roads. |
| 02:36:20.91 | Carolyn Ford | I mean, is there- All California roads. There's not a lesser one that is maybe a little more aesthetically pleasing for cities or something. I can't understand why we would have to have the same heavy duty guardrail here in the city as they do on the freeway. The speeds are definitely different. |
| 02:36:25.55 | Mary Wagner | There's not. |
| 02:36:25.97 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:36:45.87 | Jonathon Goldman | Uh, There's a report attached. There's a special report attached to your staff report that kind of goes through some of the discussions. There are, I didn't include it in here, but on the... on the steel There's a variation of that, and they label it a timber barrier, but what it is is really a steel barrier clad with timber. And that has been approved by the state of California for all speeds, I believe. Well, speed limits that are within our local speeds, I think it's, I'm not sure if it's 55 kilometers per hour, which is like 30, 35, or lower. That's generally the streets, you know, the speeds that people travel within the city of Sausalito. What I don't know is how well they resist large trucks because the accident that occurred on Rodeo a few years ago was like a, I think, a cement cement truck or a dump truck. And if that's fully loaded, |
| 02:37:18.08 | Mary Wagner | Uh-huh. |
| 02:38:01.03 | Jonathon Goldman | it. Other types of guardrails may not be adequate. I was reading a report on Cable. Those aren't approved in the state of California, but they are approved elsewhere. Within the state and national parks, there are certain types of guardrails, but again, they haven't gone through the rigorous testing that these two classes of barriers have gone through. |
| 02:38:33.60 | Carolyn Ford | OK. Well, all right. That was one of my questions. Surely we wouldn't have to have a guardrail that's as robust as those on the freeway. The second question I have is what's the current process you've you decide that we need a guardrail on curry, for instance. Do you then design something and take it to platting? |
| 02:39:04.16 | Jonathon Goldman | That would be the process that I would undergo. |
| 02:39:08.78 | Carolyn Ford | Okay. And that is a process that's worked in the past? Or what's the issue here? |
| 02:39:13.64 | Jonathon Goldman | Oh, I think in the past there was perhaps an ignorance on the part of staff about whether or not this type of device needed to undergo design review. And they just did it. and got this really negative feedback. What I'm concerned about is... Bye. what type of feedback we might get. You know, it's like, I don't like the three ridges. I don't like the two ridges. Can you give us, can you paint it? Can you chrome plate it for the steel ones? |
| 02:39:52.74 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. |
| 02:39:52.96 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:39:53.00 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:39:53.01 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:39:55.78 | Jonathon Goldman | any and any type of combination is possible during those types of hearings And. You can't change the height You can change the end treatments and you can change the lengths. And on the concrete ones, there are the standards for an aesthetic |
| 02:40:15.78 | Bob Dar | So, so. |
| 02:40:26.58 | Jonathon Goldman | Uh, are very narrow. It took me a long time to figure it out. They specify how deep a groove can be, how the angle of the groove can be, because if the shape is maybe too boulder-like, it could snag a car. If the grooving is oriented in a certain way, it could launch a vehicle if it hit it. So there's just a very, very narrow range of alternative variations that could occur. |
| 02:40:57.53 | Bob Dar | Very nice. |
| 02:41:06.86 | Carolyn Ford | So you're telling me that we have to use these freeway-type guardrails in the city, even in our 25-mile-per-hour residential areas? |
| 02:41:19.33 | Jonathon Goldman | I'm strongly recommending that because you want to protect the organization from claims from loss of life. And this is two ways, you know, person in the car as well as innocent bystander than the property next to it. We hope in 99.999% of the time it doesn't happen, but that one time, I don't wanna be, staff if that one time was on my watch with a system that failed. as a professional advising you, I don't believe it's in the city's best interest to consider large variations from these standards. |
| 02:42:16.97 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Murray. |
| 02:42:17.02 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. that might occur during the design review process. |
| 02:42:21.99 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor? |
| 02:42:22.75 | Jonathon Goldman | Yep. |
| 02:42:23.42 | Jonathan Leone | So Todd, Just to confirm this report that was included in our staff report, I see a lot of options here. that adhere to federal and state guidelines for guardrails. Is that correct? |
| 02:42:41.76 | Jonathon Goldman | there's basically three, although there's Thank you. |
| 02:42:45.07 | Jonathan Leone | Well, there's... |
| 02:42:45.56 | Jonathon Goldman | There's the |
| 02:42:50.08 | Jonathan Leone | So correct me. |
| 02:42:50.57 | Jonathon Goldman | Conventional steel. There's, with, this one has what we call three ridges. That's a three beam barrier. The typical one is a two beam barrier. |
| 02:43:04.85 | Jonathan Leone | I'm sorry, I wasn't specific. Let me be more specific. In the report that was included, I'm seeing a timber guardrail that you alluded to earlier that looks, you know, very handsome to me. I'm seeing the precast concrete guardrail with kind of a brickwork in it. It looks very handsome to me. I'm seeing the stone masonry guardrail. I'm seeing the stone masonry guardrail. wall with a nice jagged stone masonry So I'm seeing, you know, and I'm seeing different pictures of examples of those guardrails. So And these all meet federal and state highway standards, correct? |
| 02:43:44.33 | Jonathon Goldman | And then- highway standards, correct? They don't all meet. If you read it, they don't all meet. They don't all meet. The, the, the, the, |
| 02:43:50.21 | Jonathan Leone | They don't all? |
| 02:43:51.44 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:43:51.59 | Jonathan Leone | I'm like, |
| 02:43:51.96 | Bob Dar | Uh... |
| 02:43:54.92 | Jonathon Goldman | this one is a variation of the precast concrete one. It's also a variation of this, you know, from a |
| 02:44:03.96 | Bob Dar | you know, Thank you. |
| 02:44:07.01 | Jonathon Goldman | collision risk standpoint this and that are very similar. Thank you. |
| 02:44:14.63 | Mary Wagner | Okay. |
| 02:44:14.84 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. There is a timber variation that I did not include in this presentation, but based on a careful reading of that, that's basically a steel |
| 02:44:24.73 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:44:27.97 | Jonathon Goldman | It does have a timber cladding. |
| 02:44:29.24 | Mary Wagner | It is. class. |
| 02:44:32.97 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. It looks good. |
| 02:44:33.32 | Jonathon Goldman | But it's the steel that gives it the strength to keep the cars in. |
| 02:44:34.45 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. |
| 02:44:39.21 | Jonathan Leone | Yeah, but we were talking about safety and aesthetics. And so if it's true here that the timber guardrail, for example, and then the other |
| 02:44:42.42 | Jonathon Goldman | Yes, and... |
| 02:44:49.25 | Jonathan Leone | example you showed meets the guidelines. uh, I just wanted to confirm that because it does seem to me that we don't necessarily then would have to sacrifice aesthetics for safety. |
| 02:44:57.25 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:44:57.30 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. |
| 02:44:57.67 | Bob Dar | See you. |
| 02:45:04.59 | Jonathan Leone | or make a choice between the two. |
| 02:45:04.61 | Jonathon Goldman | No, um... Yeah. you know These are very pretty, but they're also very expensive. You know, from a delivery standpoint and from a design standpoint, I think |
| 02:45:19.46 | Bob Dar | you know, |
| 02:45:27.32 | Jonathon Goldman | Our initial approach would be to start with this and then go next with some variation of this, but you're tripling or quadrupling the price. |
| 02:45:44.38 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Nair, a quick follow-up? Go ahead. Thank you. So is the timber guardrail, did you say quadruple the price of |
| 02:45:46.43 | Jonathon Goldman | Go ahead. |
| 02:45:53.87 | Mary Wagner | about this. |
| 02:45:55.07 | Jonathan Leone | Or are you referring to just this masonry work here? Okay. So what about the timber? I guess, you know, I'm... |
| 02:45:56.72 | Mary Wagner | masonry work here. |
| 02:45:58.04 | Jonathon Goldman | one. |
| 02:46:04.53 | Jonathon Goldman | Yeah. That's probably – it's definitely more expensive than the |
| 02:46:07.47 | Jonathan Leone | expensive. |
| 02:46:08.94 | Jonathon Goldman | Bye. |
| 02:46:08.97 | Jonathan Leone | Mm-hmm. |
| 02:46:09.36 | Jonathon Goldman | conventional galvanize, but probably not. |
| 02:46:11.35 | Jonathan Leone | Mm-hmm. |
| 02:46:14.10 | Jonathon Goldman | Not a lot. |
| 02:46:15.03 | Jonathan Leone | Okay, thank you. |
| 02:46:17.19 | Jonathon Goldman | Okay. Any other questions? |
| 02:46:19.97 | Herb Weiner | There are relative prices in that report. Okay. Is there any questions from the public? Go ahead. |
| 02:46:34.15 | Fran Nelson | Fran Nelson I live on Toy Online just a quick question I assume you can paint the guardrail So you could make it blend it, paint it green or brown Okay, and just one other quick comment while I'm here. I've always wondered why at the top of Monomar, or rodeo, you can't put a sign saying no large trucks. I've seen so many things stuck. in the toy online cul-de-sac just in the short time I've lived here. And it just would be so simple to put a sign there. |
| 02:47:10.78 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. Okay, any other questions from the public? Okay, let's bring it back up here. |
| 02:47:16.47 | Jonathan Leone | There one possible scenario here is to deal with this somewhat similarly to requests for undergrounding, where you have the basic package that you get that really safety is first here, though these are not beautiful things. And having sat through this 2004 nonsense, I think this was all part of the 33 Miller, the previous owner of 33 Miller's, his project was for the Planning Commission. that the residents, one of the things that we've seen with the underground is the residents trying to put money into the game to pay for the undergrounding and as a way to upgrade kind of the appearance of their street and perhaps with these more expensive, like the timber is three times, or close to three times the steel barrier cost. that might be something where you go to the community and say, hey, we're thinking about getting a guardrail for your safety. But there are these other options. They require some share of money or costs amongst the neighborhood. And would people be willing to do that? I'm not saying that will happen. That's a very tough thing to manage that process. But it is a possibility. But to me, the safety is first, and there's no way to really make any guardrail look nice. Some of these treatments are better than others, but I wouldn't want to leave it to laymen, because if you look at what, including myself, because basically one of the things it says in this report is some patterns and textures with high relief cause excessive passenger compartment deformation in the vehicle. Well, I wouldn't want to be the one to judge to say what pattern is right. So as far as developing a Sausalito standard, that doesn't make any sense. I understand Todd's putting it out there as a straw man, but I think we're better off erring on the side of safety, and if the neighborhood wants to be a part of upgrading it to a more expensive material, maybe that's a... But, you know, we should always, I think the surprise with 33 Miller was, if I remember, and this is seven years ago, so you may remember it better than me, but, is it appeared suddenly, and then it breathed out, and people freaked out, and said all of a sudden there was a guardrail there. So, like anything. whether it's a sidewalk or cutting a limb off a tree is probably one of those things you've got to make sure you touch everyone in the neighborhood first before we stick one of these things in, even if there's a real need in the case of that ban. So but the option two here as far as just, Mary can speak to how soon all these other omnibus stuff would be delivered, but you kind of missed the first round. I think it's already through the Planning Commission of the easy one. |
| 02:50:11.89 | Linda Pfeifer | The first bucket, if you will, that first chart is going to the Planning Commission for their recommendation at their next meeting, which is on Wednesday, a week from tomorrow. So it's too late to make that round of discussion. |
| 02:50:25.94 | Jonathan Leone | But the likelihood they're going to decide that in one meeting? Well, they've been through it three times now. Oh, that's right. You're right. You're right. |
| 02:50:29.17 | Linda Pfeifer | Well, they've been through it three times now. Oh, that's right. |
| 02:50:32.07 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:50:34.15 | Linda Pfeifer | hopefully optimistic that they are cautiously optimistic that it will happen. This would be put then on the next round and with your direction, these have all been going through the alleged committee and then on to the planning commission and eventually we'll come back to the city council. It could be at the top of that. |
| 02:50:36.31 | Bob Dar | They are. |
| 02:50:38.78 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 02:50:38.99 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:50:39.00 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 02:50:39.04 | Bob Dar | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 02:50:41.03 | Mary Wagner | Right. |
| 02:50:47.51 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 02:50:50.40 | Linda Pfeifer | policy list because it's a safety issue. |
| 02:50:51.85 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:50:54.21 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 02:50:54.23 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. |
| 02:50:54.36 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 02:50:54.44 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. |
| 02:50:54.46 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. Mr. Mayor? |
| 02:50:55.81 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 02:50:55.83 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:50:55.93 | Herb Weiner | you |
| 02:50:56.12 | Mary Wagner | you Thank you. |
| 02:50:56.27 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. Yes |
| 02:50:57.28 | Carolyn Ford | I am hoping that there's some way that we can balance aesthetics with safety. And I agree with one thing about having the neighbors pitch in if it is, if they don't want an ugly guardrail in their neighborhood. I certainly wouldn't want to live with the two choices here. They're just ugly. And so I think neighbors should have the option of... of weighing in and yes, perhaps they could be painted and plantings, landscaping could hide them a bit, that would be nice, but if that's not doable then we need to have a means the neighborhood to weigh in and for this to be heard. And so therefore, I think that it should continue to go before the Planning Commission As a way of doing that, the Planning Commission can have the rules of what we can and cannot do and what the costs are. They notify, it's part of the process that neighbors are notified if something is happening in their neighborhood. And they show up at the Planning Commission. The Planning Commission hears it and determines which way it should go. So that would be my recommendation is to keep this at the Planning Commission with design review so that neighbors, so that residents can weigh in and have a voice in what goes into their neighborhood. |
| 02:52:50.14 | Jonathan Leone | Can I have a question to Todd? Todd, I think right now the problem is there is no formal process here. They don't go to the Planning Commission. So the question is, what process do we want to use for Garneville? It's kind of a... They haven't been considered major public projects that would go to the Planning Commission by and large. |
| 02:53:09.02 | Jonathon Goldman | Is that correct? I believe so. Like I said, my big concern is that the debate will expand outside the range of variables that can be modified. |
| 02:53:20.06 | Mary Wagner | Right. |
| 02:53:21.33 | Bob Dar | area. |
| 02:53:22.20 | Stan Baer | that. |
| 02:53:22.27 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 02:53:27.40 | Jonathon Goldman | Yeah, that's a problem. Thank you. |
| 02:53:29.14 | Stan Baer | Well, |
| 02:53:30.47 | Carolyn Ford | Excuse me, Todd. Go ahead. But you would give the Planning Commission the requirements and the specifications so they could understand that and make a judgment on it. Right? So... |
| 02:53:33.24 | Stan Baer | Go ahead. |
| 02:53:33.54 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:53:33.64 | Stan Baer | Thank you. |
| 02:53:33.71 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:53:46.91 | Jonathon Goldman | Yeah, very much so. |
| 02:53:48.21 | Carolyn Ford | Yeah. So I just as I do everything else, I think that's a workable process. Do you see anything? |
| 02:54:01.93 | Jonathon Goldman | Well, frankly, I've been concerned by the process, how the Planning Commission has weighed in on the Viño de Mar as well as the bathrooms. But I haven't been involved with those lately and closely. |
| 02:54:12.98 | Tom Hoover | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 02:54:13.87 | Mary Wagner | Yeah. |
| 02:54:14.26 | Tom Hoover | you |
| 02:54:14.38 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:54:22.23 | Jonathon Goldman | I am your servant, so we will do what you... I'll have ham and eggs on that. |
| 02:54:25.82 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 02:54:25.87 | Pam Granger | No, you're not a student. |
| 02:54:27.04 | Herb Weiner | will do what you order us to do. I'll have ham and eggs on that. Thank you. Yes, Mary. |
| 02:54:34.28 | Linda Pfeifer | Thank you. thought to put into this process and maybe to direct back to the omnibus process is there is a provision for an administrative design review, which is a staff level design review. It's still a noticed public hearing, but it's held by the community development director. And it currently allows for admin design review of capital improvement projects appropriate for staff review as determined by the planning commission. Because this is such a narrow bucket, if you will, of items that are available, it might be appropriate not to bring it to a full loan planning commission hearing, but if there's an in-between step. So it's not completely staff, it's an admin hearing at the staff level, just to put that into your thought process. |
| 02:55:25.27 | Herb Weiner | Yes, yes, sir. |
| 02:55:26.93 | Adam Politzer | Just responding to Councilmember Ford's comments about having the platform which starts here and then at the neighborhood wants to upgrade it, then they can financially Participate. The only caution, and I think where our city engineer is being maybe a little reserved, |
| 02:55:43.95 | Bob Dar | Maybe. |
| 02:55:46.84 | Adam Politzer | is when you look back at the undergrounding process, does everyone have to participate or just a few? Then it's the haves and the have-nots that get caught up into that, and that was part of the disaster of the undergrounding projects that occurred back in, I think, 2006, 2007. Yeah. |
| 02:55:59.71 | Mary Wagner | about it. |
| 02:55:59.97 | Bob Dar | Thank you. |
| 02:56:08.56 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 02:56:09.70 | Adam Politzer | So, you know, You can give them the options, but what the city can afford maybe the direction that the council says here's going to be the standard AND IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S $60 a meter or $160 a meter for the timber guardrail. or going up to the $740 and onward. based on the aesthetic values. So that's the challenge when you bring it in front of the planning commission. and say, okay, you can upgrade this. but then how do you actually implement the upgrade? How do you say everybody on the street put in and if you can't, |
| 02:56:49.34 | Bob Dar | Yeah. |
| 02:56:50.39 | Adam Politzer | which is this is where it caused some tumbling, then put a reverse lean on your home. No, I think you stay away from all that. It gets really, really messy. And I think you're playing with a situation that puts the Planning Commission in a very difficult position. Because no one's going to disagree about the aesthetics. |
| 02:56:54.62 | Jonathan Leone | No, I think you stay away from all that. Yeah. |
| 02:57:07.38 | Adam Politzer | And they're all going to say, yes, this looks ugly. But at the end of the day, they're also all going to agree that it does its job. This is its job. Now how can we paint it, as heard from a member of the public how can we put planting behind it because I don't think you can put planting in front of it because you don't want to catch the cars as Todd has been mentioning. So I do think it probably has some work to go through the process with the Planning Commission to have it vetted. but ultimately, I think you're caught in a situation where Um, there's not a lot of variables for you to consider as options. |
| 02:57:48.83 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor? Yes. |
| 02:57:49.72 | Adam Politzer | Thank you. |
| 02:57:49.77 | Fran Nelson | Yes. |
| 02:57:51.63 | Jonathan Leone | So, in my experience, there is nothing more controversial than going into a neighborhood and doing something in a neighborhood in Sausalito. And this, you know, depending on where it would be going could be If it's near a freeway, it could be very, you know, innocuous and low profile and folks wouldn't care or if it's in you know, in the trenches of a street, a local street in neighborhoods, there could be an uproar. So I think that a process that Includes noticing, includes participation, and allows the neighborhood to get involved and have input is critical here. And I think it will save staff time, and I think it will save, and time is money. So whether it's, you know, an administrative, and Mary, you said that administrative, there's a noticing process. know i would i would uh support anything that included participation participation and notification of the neighborhood |
| 02:59:02.62 | Herb Weiner | Okay. If you really look at where these guardrails were going to be put, it seems that they're coming off the highway, whether it's Montemar or Currie, To hide the guardrail, that's all I know, when I'm driving and it's raining and I see and it sticks out on me. I know to slow down. rather than to cover it up that it doesn't exist so when you bounce off of it, you now just know that you just hit something. Uh... No one likes a stop sign. Stop signs aren't pretty, but they serve a purpose. And God will serve a purpose, not only to protect the lives of people from homes possibly below them, But the very idea is When you see a guardrail, common sense comes into your thinking or should that this is an area that could be very dangerous when it gets wet. And it's kind of like telling people to slow down without a slow down sign. So I really like the idea. Of course, we all want aesthetically to make it look beautiful, but I also want it to have a safety. The safety purpose is first. And that's what you do when you see a guardrail. You slow down because you know someone's bounced off of it. And most of the times if you look at guardrails, you'll see some markings that indicate someone did bounce off of it. So I think the more it stands out, the more it acts as a safety feature rather than trying to hide it and think that will work better. Yes. |
| 03:00:46.59 | Mike Kelly | It is what it is. It's a barrier to keep cars from smashing into something else. And it ain't pretty, but neither are cars parked on Monty Mar strewn out all over the side of the road there. They are every day, every morning, Monday through Friday. Asphalt roads are ugly. Stop signs are ugly. High costs of alternative things are ugly to me. And the stone thing that you showed up there, I think that's hideous. So I say there's no approval process for this. It's a safety issue. It should not go before the Planning Commission. It should go administratively perhaps to take a look and see if there's some alternative where you place it or how you might camouflage it with landscaping or paint or something. But it's there for a purpose and every one of the things you showed up there needed a guardrail. And so I say we take this out of the design review process and put it into administrative approval. |
| 03:01:44.66 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. All right. |
| 03:01:47.20 | Mike Kelly | Show us the four options you need. Thank you. |
| 03:01:51.10 | Mary Wagner | you Mm-hmm. |
| 03:02:03.81 | Mike Kelly | I make a motion to direct staff to prepare a resolution exempting guardrails from design |
| 03:02:09.33 | Carolyn Ford | Um, could I? . |
| 03:02:11.03 | Herb Weiner | Wait a minute. Is there a second? I want to hear how this whole plays out a little bit. |
| 03:02:17.53 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 03:02:18.19 | Carolyn Ford | I would like to, Mr. Mayor. Yes. I would like to amend that somewhat and follow what our city attorney has recommended or has suggested as an option. And that would be to have administrative design review so that, yes, we can get the guardrails in, but we can also get the residents' input and save staff time in that regard |
| 03:02:20.06 | Jonathan Leone | YES. |
| 03:02:20.45 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 03:02:50.57 | Carolyn Ford | uh, from being pounded on, no doubt, when they put something very ugly right in the middle of a residence. So the residence will be notified. and that would be good. to make that short i would just suggest that we amend it with the staff review design review and for resident input |
| 03:03:23.48 | Mike Kelly | What do you think? |
| 03:03:23.86 | Carolyn Ford | you |
| 03:03:25.18 | Herb Weiner | Okay, well, do we have a second on any of these? |
| 03:03:31.44 | Herb Weiner | concerted. |
| 03:03:32.81 | Jonathan Leone | second |
| 03:03:34.88 | Herb Weiner | Okay. |
| 03:03:35.98 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. I was waiting for the earthquake if that hadn't happened. Just teasing. |
| 03:03:41.51 | Mary Wagner | Just teasing. Just teasing. I was expecting you to second that. |
| 03:03:42.06 | Herb Weiner | I was expecting you to second that. Debbie, do you want to make a roll on that amended motion? |
| 03:03:54.00 | Jonathan Leone | But you have a shorter term need for the moment, right? And you have one project because that's going to be some time before that comes back. Which one of these is actually in the process of planning? The one that's farthest from the project. |
| 03:03:54.51 | Herb Weiner | but you have a shorter |
| 03:04:00.99 | Jonathon Goldman | you. The one that's... you |
| 03:04:05.04 | Jonathan Leone | as long as it's done. |
| 03:04:05.36 | Jonathon Goldman | The clan. Thank you. |
| 03:04:06.98 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. |
| 03:04:07.10 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 03:04:07.13 | Jonathon Goldman | Okay. |
| 03:04:07.18 | Jonathan Leone | you What's your time frame for that, would you guess? |
| 03:04:10.20 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. |
| 03:04:10.22 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 03:04:10.25 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. This helps a lot. We could take that plan. |
| 03:04:15.32 | Jonathan Leone | If you had, if all your ducks were in a row, you know, you had none of this to worry about, when would you have not do the Glen project by the time you designed it and put it in place? Oh, this spring. Spring. Okay, so this could be in place by then. Okay. Gabby? Gabby? |
| 03:04:34.01 | Unknown | Councilmember Pfeiffer? Thank you. |
| 03:04:35.65 | Jonathan Leone | Yes. |
| 03:04:36.61 | Unknown | you |
| 03:04:36.66 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 03:04:37.54 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 03:04:37.57 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
| 03:04:37.76 | Unknown | Council Member Ford? Yes. Council Member Leon? |
| 03:04:37.78 | Unknown | Who's |
| 03:04:41.98 | Unknown | Yes. |
| 03:04:42.33 | Unknown | you Vice Mayor Kelly. Thank you. |
| 03:04:45.64 | Unknown | don't. |
| 03:04:45.96 | Unknown | Thank you. Mayor Leanne Dutton. Come here, this is why. |
| 03:04:49.50 | Fran Nelson | Thank you. Bye. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. |
| 03:04:51.11 | Herb Weiner | you |
| 03:04:51.14 | Carolyn Ford | Yeah. |
| 03:04:51.28 | Herb Weiner | Thank you. |
| 03:04:51.43 | Carolyn Ford | Thank you. |
| 03:04:51.48 | Fran Nelson | Thank you. |
| 03:04:53.99 | Jonathan Leone | So you'll come back to us with that. That language will all come back to us first, right? There's no language to vote on. What the criteria is. We've got a resolution. |
| 03:05:01.17 | Jonathon Goldman | Thank you. |
| 03:05:01.18 | Tom Hoover | Yeah, we do. |
| 03:05:02.03 | Jonathon Goldman | That was air resolution. |
| 03:05:02.97 | Tom Hoover | So we'll come back. |
| 03:05:06.08 | Bob Licht | Thank you. |
| 03:05:06.11 | Herb Weiner | Okay? All right, thank you, Todd. All right. Let's move on to city manager information. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, I went through that public comment. Yeah. Okay. City manager's report. |
| 03:05:20.25 | Mary Wagner | Thank you. Thank you. |
| 03:05:24.01 | Mary Wagner | Thanks, sir. |
| 03:05:28.79 | Adam Politzer | Just a handful of dates, reminders here, and then one just general comment. We have this Thursday night at 6 o'clock, here in the council chambers, the annexation workshop the discussion. I'm with the community, so that will be here in the council chambers. that will also be on Webstream. And so folks can watch it from home. And if they don't want to take the time to come down, the workshop that was held earlier in October. is also on the website and folks can review that information as well, plus all the written material. also announcing that the LAFCO public hearing is on I'm not. the November 10th date, so that will come forward. and that information is also on the website. Our strategic planning session for the City Council and the management team is scheduled for November 11th and so staff is preparing information to provide to the council at a time and then after the retreat. on the strategic planning retreat. That information will be posted on the website, so it's available to the public as well. Uh, The last is that we heard a presentation from the school district maybe at our last meeting or the meeting prior to that. I met with the new superintendent of the schools, Valerie Pitts, today and talked about a variety of things. One, just some of the things that they are working on at the school. both at Willow Creek and Bayside and MLK, and then to start exploring opportunities for the city to participate with the school district in a variety of ways, one just in and our resources. including the school does have a community garden, And is there an opportunity for staff to support their efforts since we have I felt that drive tractors and have bequots. stuff like that. So if there's an opportunity when we have that equipment out, to come by and dig a trench for them or help them with their efforts, we'll try to extend those services. Um, Then we obviously progressed into shared services and opportunities to talk about what we can do. to offset some of their costs and generate some new revenue for the city. or expand their facilities with our new librarian Abbott Chambers. He and I had a discussion about their library that they have on campus. that is basically staffed one day a week. and that's during best of circumstances. you an opportunity to look at at using our staff and our volunteers to make the library open for their students more than one day a week but then also look at extending the hours of the library to have a dedicated children's library on that campus so that in the evenings and on the weekends, and during the vacation and summer schedule extend the library to all of the youth here in Sausalito. Again, very preliminary discussions, nothing, you know, other than brainstorming ideas right now, but again, looking at the resources that we have, the talented staff that we have, the facilities that they have on their campus and see if there's an opportunity for us to explore new ways to provide service to our community and maybe new revenue streams to support those services. That concludes my report. Happy to answer any questions from the council. |
| 03:09:22.20 | Jonathan Leone | And actually, a couple of the board members have talked to me about the same things, about the ball fields and the community garden actually becoming a community garden rather than just they were more than happy to expand its use potentially. And the library is a great idea. And the same thing with the playground there, which is a great playground, but it's closed on the weekends, or non-school hours. So that would be great. I mean, that's an awesome playground. You drive by and look in awe and in drooling. My kids are drooling as they drive by. So that would be, those are all great ideas. |
| 03:09:38.83 | Bob Licht | Thank you. |
| 03:09:49.85 | Unknown | Thank you. |
| 03:10:04.56 | Adam Politzer | If I can just follow up on Council Member Leon's comments. You know, the city has been looking at a community center for probably 10 years. and we disbanded the community center task force when we made it a priority to focus and have nothing competing with the public safety facilities. Most cities and school districts partner together and you can look at the city of Oxford, I had that experience. in Palo Alto. It's a pretty common practice to look at building a gymnasium or a community center or a multipurpose room with the school. and with the city. You know, Valerie said that they're exploring that opportunity on their campus because they have space and there may be an opportunity again to look at at the school as a civic center of sorts. And in a lot of other communities, your school is a gathering place, it's a community center. which has multiple uses there. So again, a long ways away from this ever being anything of |
| 03:11:03.88 | Bob Dar | So again, |
| 03:11:07.50 | Adam Politzer | of real substance, but it is good discussion and it's something that I hope that the school brings forward ideas that we can bring back to the council for their direction and feedback. |
| 03:11:22.03 | Herb Weiner | Thank you, Adam. All right, moving on. Future agenda items? |
| 03:11:30.25 | Jonathan Leone | Mr. Mayor. |
| 03:11:30.91 | Herb Weiner | Yes. |
| 03:11:32.70 | Jonathan Leone | So I would ask again that we schedule interviews for the Arts Commission to move that along. I would also ask that we revisit criteria for agenda items for the Finance and OMIT Committee. And again, I would ask a future agenda item to replace action minutes with narrative minutes to... future agenda item to replace action minutes with narrative minutes to provide transparency to the public. |
| 03:12:09.89 | Herb Weiner | Okay. Okay, any other future items? |
| 03:12:17.62 | Herb Weiner | Okay, next. We're going to honor council member committee reports. Any at this time? Okay. Appointment for the boards on MCC. I will have that by the 15th. the council appointments for the hospitality. At this time here I'd like to put in the name of Yoshitomi and Jeff Shirash, and that would go until 2012. Are there any other? names that would want to be placed on this? Any other nominations? Okay, any questions? Public comment? Okay. So those are my two names. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Okay. |
| 03:13:09.17 | Carolyn Ford | I... Thank you. |
| 03:13:13.24 | Herb Weiner | And I think... move to adjournment. |
| 03:13:17.49 | Jonathan Leone | I have a comment. I noticed that in looking at the council positions on committees, I've noticed that I have, if I take out the alternate assignments, that I have two committees. Council Member Ford has three. |
| 03:13:18.35 | Herb Weiner | Yes. |
| 03:13:32.88 | Mary Wagner | Council. Mm-hmm. |
| 03:13:36.24 | Jonathan Leone | Vice Mayor Kelly has 10. Council Member Leon has 11. And Mayor Weiner, you have 10. |
| 03:13:44.49 | Herb Weiner | Gee, I thought I had 11. Okay. |
| 03:13:45.07 | Jonathan Leone | and the other. |
| 03:13:45.25 | Unknown | Thank you. |
| 03:13:45.32 | Jonathan Leone | I'm not sure. Well, I believe that there is an equity here in the council assignments, and I would encourage you to consider appointing Council Member Ford and or myself to more committees. We are ready, we are willing, we are able, and it would make a lot of sense, frankly. And I think that the situation is not lost on the community. Thank you. |
| 03:14:18.87 | Herb Weiner | Okay, with that, meeting adjourned. Bingo. |
| 03:14:18.92 | Jonathan Leone | Thank you. |
Tom Hoover — Neutral: Questioned the legal requirements and warrants needed for boarding boats, emphasizing concerns about entry procedures. ▶ 📄
Johnston Malbastad — In Favor: Expressed gratitude for the marine patrol, noting a significant reduction in disturbances like speeding and noise near his residence, and criticized RBRA for not fulfilling its enforcement mandate. ▶ 📄